Syd

Chal Ravens

Are we on? Yes. Before we begin, could I ask everybody to please turn your phones off, and please don’t take any photos or film anything while we’re going. So hi. Welcome to this special RBMA lecture in London. My name is Chal Ravens, and I’m excited to be here as part of Red Bull Music Academy Parts Unknown, which is this weekend’s series of events, lectures, and workshops all about exploring what happens when artists step beyond their creative comfort zone, and how that can push their art forward. So with that in mind, I’d like to introduce a producer, DJ, singer and serial collaborator, Syd. [applause]

Syd

Hey. Thanks for coming, guys. Appreciate it.

Chal Ravens

We’re gonna be talking about various things, working with Odd Future, your production process in the studio, stuff like that, but I thought we’d begin by talking a bit about live performance. Obviously, so one of the themes this weekend is collaboration. You’ve collaborated with many, many people. Janelle Monae, Isaiah Rashad, all of Odd Future, who else? Vic Mensa. There are so many.

Syd

Yeah.

Chal Ravens

But you had said that you didn’t really... You hadn’t really imagined touring your solo album as a solo artist, but actually you just finished the American leg of your solo tour. So what happened there? Why did you decide to go out on your own?

Syd

Good question. One, just to give the album another push, two, to see what it would be like, and three, to make some money. Shit. [laughter]

Chal Ravens

And how was the experience compared to how you might have thought it would be?

Syd

Better, it was better than I thought it would be. I was scared to do it because I didn’t know what a Syd show would look like. I’m so used to performing with the Internet and the reason we have a band in the first place is because I was too nervous in the beginning to sing over a two-track. Just a DJ. So I was like, “Let’s get a band, take some of the attention away from me,” and it turned into what it is now. And I was a little confused on what to do with the solo Syd show. “Do I get another band, do I get a DJ? What do I do?” It took a little while but I figured it out and here we are.

Chal Ravens

And what did you learn about yourself as a performer, because it must have been different when you know that you’re the sole focus of attention.

Syd

I learned that I have more potential than I thought I did as a performer. That I can step out of my comfort zone if I really want to, if I really try, and that it’s not so bad singing on top of a two-track.

Chal Ravens

Is it true that as part of developing an on-stage persona for yourself that you studied the D’Angelo video for “Untitled?” Which, I’m sure we all know the video.

Syd

No I didn’t study that music video. I used to watch D’Angelo concerts on YouTube. He has two or three full length concerts on YouTube. One for São Paulo Brazil at a festival and that was the main one. I used to study that one, study his stage presence and his voice. Just the whole energy, because he’s one of my favorite performers.

Chal Ravens

What is it exactly that he does that you’ve tried to absorb?

Syd

He’s able to bring so much energy to a soul show. A lot of the soul-type R&B concerts you go to it’s very mellow, and people forget that I started out as a DJ for Odd Future, going crazy. So when I started performing with the Internet, it was really intimidating being in front of calmer crowds. At first I took it the wrong way, like, “Maybe we suck because they’re not going crazy.” And then I had to reprogram my thinking and realize that every crowd is different and so I used to watch D’Angelo because... I don’t know if you guys have ever looked up D’Angelo live on Youtube, but he’s going crazy. He’s on stage going ham, turning up. He’ll turn a three-minute song into a ten-minute vamp and I just thought that was just amazing. Is he still singing “Brown Sugar?” Damn. It’s crazy. So I just studied that, like how to turn this one song into this whole experience and how to bring energy to R&B soul music, live.

Chal Ravens

So let’s talk about the recent album then, Fin, your solo album. To explore this idea of collaboration, one of the themes, why was it important for you to allow yourself to be working with lots of other producers this time? What was the reason to be opening yourself up to that rather than just saying, “Here’s a solo Syd record, just me?”

Syd

To be honest, I did a lot of those sessions with the intention of giving those songs away to other artists, because I really want to be a songwriter. At the time I didn’t really want to put out a solo album like that. I wanted to write songs for all these other artists out there, because in the back of my brain I’m still a behind the scenes person.

Chal Ravens

Is there a sense of you thinking that you’re writing for other people in order to downplay how big a deal it is to go solo?

Syd

Definitely. That’s what it turned into, and it’s funny because my A&R was the one who booked me all these sessions, and I’m like, “Oh dope, I get to work with Hit Boy. I’m going to get his song to so and so,” and I hadn’t even signed my record deal yet, my solo deal. But the A&R at Sony was already putting me in with all these amazing producers, so me, I’m like, “OK I’m going to use this to my advantage and shop these songs around. I have a publishing deal, let me send these to my publisher and see what happens,” and then slowly but surely I guess I grew attached to the songs and it turned into Fin.

Chal Ravens

What kind of artist did you imagine singing those songs, or hope?

Syd

I don’t know. I didn’t really think about that when I was writing them. I wanted to write songs that I would be comfortable with putting out myself. Songs that I genuinely would want to sing myself, because I feel like that’s the best way to write and produce for other artists is to give them something that you truly think is fire. Give them some of you. That’s what I love so much about Pharrell [Williams] and the Timbalands and the Dark Childs, is that when they’re working with an artist they’re not trying to give that artist what they already have. They’re trying to give them something new, something fresh, something that’s theirs.

Chal Ravens

So when you started writing those songs, they were still your songs. You didn’t imagine somebody else taking them over. They were your lyrics, your stories?

Syd

Definitely. My stories and my lyrics. And in my head I was like, “Let me play these for some folks and see who might want them.” I also came to realize that I have a pretty specific voice, and that not anybody can sing my songs. And I also have a pretty specific subject matter, so unless I’m writing for a man...

Chal Ravens

With a really high voice.

Syd

With a high-pitched voice. It just became a hassle trying to pitch the songs. I was like, “You know what, nobody’s going to understand this the way I do unless they hear me sing it.”

Chal Ravens

So how much work had you done before you realized, “Oh it’s a Syd album.” And then once you thought that, was there much work left? Did that change how you were working on it?

Syd

I probably didn’t realize it until I’d say maybe eight songs. I still had them in a folder with a bunch of other beats that I made a long time ago, some songs that I’d written a long time ago, just to see what I had, and then I realized I had a whole body of work, and I was like, “Oh snap, I have a whole album right here. That’s crazy.” Thankfully, at the time, I was in a good position to negotiate a nice deal with Sony for one album, and that album was already finished. So, I finished it. Good business. [laughter]

Chal Ravens

How do you write best? Do you have to start with an idea alone and build it up quite a way, or do you look to a collaborator quite quickly to get more feedback and...

Syd

These days, I’ll just freestyle something. I’ll just sing some melodies over something, and I like to start with the beat. I’m a producer still, so I make the beat first, or get the beat first. Start singing some stuff, and then I try to just let words kind of come out. I might be mumbling something and see, “What does that sound like?” Because I’m all about consonants and syllables and stuff like that. I like to write like it’s a puzzle, so rather than really thinking. “Oh, OK, I want to write a song about heartbreak,” I’ll just freestyle something, and whatever comes out... It could be have a good time, or something like that. OK, what can I turn this into? Then I’ll just spiral off of that. It’s like a snowball effect.

Chal Ravens

What do you mean by a puzzle?

Syd

Well, typically, I’ll sing a melody, say... I don’t even start singing anything until the mic is on and recording, because my first ideas are usually my best ones. So, I’ll just press record. I’ll freestyle a whole three minutes, or a minute and a half of something, and be like, “OK, that’s the verse melody right there, and that’s the chorus melody.” So, what words would fit? You can get kind of creative with subject matter, and you can write songs that aren’t even about you, because why not? It’s fun. So, yeah, I’m all about consonants and making the syllables fit, making sure it sounds natural and not forced just to get the message across.

Chal Ravens

So, do you usually have quite a complete idea by the time you have a collaborator and you’re showing them what you’ve been working on?

Syd

Well, I tend to collaborate more with producers nowadays than songwriters. On Ego Death I collaborated with a bunch of songwriters. I was having trouble finishing a lot of the songs, like “Special Affair.” I had the first three lines for three months. “Penny for your thoughts, I know what... I can read your mind even from behind. And fuck what’s in your phone, lemme take you home.” And I didn’t know what to say after that. I was stuck for months, and eventually I was like, you know what, let me bring in some songwriters to help. So, I brought in this girl named Taylor Parks. She just opened for me in Texas, and she’s an amazing songwriter. So, she came in. I sang her what I had so far. She was like, “That’s dope.” I was like, “Oh, that’s dope! OK, let’s get it.” Snowball effect.

Chal Ravens

Do you have sort of tactics that you’d use if you get stuck in the studio? Like, there’s the famous oblique strategies cards where you pull a wild idea to give you a new direction. But do you have any way of kind of getting through a difficult moment in the studio where you feel stuck?

Syd

I take breaks. I’ll take a break, smoke some weed. [laughter]

Chal Ravens

It’s a classic.

Syd

The best thing I think to do is just not to force it. I don’t really like forcing it because then it feels like work, and then I hate it, and then... I’ll step away, and if I’m stuck for a really long time, I’ll just call a friend, “Hey, can you help me finish writing this song? Because I’m stuck.” It’s one of those things, too, that... I used to feel like I wasn’t a good songwriter when I couldn’t finish a song by myself, and I had to get over that, because then you’ll never finish a song. You know, 50% of something is better than 100% of nothing, so I just...

Also, studying James Fauntleroy, I learned that it’s okay to write a bad song. Just write a new one the next day and hope that it’s better, but you got to finish the song. So, sometimes if I’m stuck, I’ll go with something that I’m not in love with. I’ll just record it, just as a placeholder. Sometimes it grows on you, sometimes that idea will grow on you. Sometimes it’ll morph into something else. So, yeah.

Chal Ravens

You’ve worked with so many different artists. What might be a similar thread that connects them, or what is it that you’re looking for in a collaborator that makes somebody good to collaborate with?

Syd

If I’m a fan, it’s that simple. I only really want to work with people that I’m fans of, so…

Chal Ravens

Has there ever been a time where you’re collaborating with someone, and you’re a fan of their work, but actually, it’s just not working in the studio and you can’t get any joy?

Syd

Let me think. I mean, yeah. Yeah. Probably. I don’t know. Damn. It’s a scary feeling. It’s a big reason that I don’t really reach out to my idols to work. The other night, somebody asked me if I had ever worked with Erykah Badu. I was like, “No.” They were like, “Why?” And I was like, “I mean, she’s just one of my idols, and I’d be scared that it wouldn’t come out how I dreamed.” You know? Also, I like having stuff to look forward to.

Chal Ravens

We’re going to play a track. We’re going to play “Shake Em Off,” from the new album.

Syd

Cool.

Chal Ravens

Could you just introduce us and tell me who you worked with on this track?

Syd

“Shake Em Off” was produced by Hit Boy. He’s an amazing producer. He’s still working on FruityLoops, which I think is amazing, and not like the MacBook version of FruityLoops, he has a MacBook, and then he has a PC over here. He’ll just go over here and start making a beat. I walked in the studio and he was playing these chords, and I was like, “Yeah, yeah. Right there, yep, that’s it. It’s done.” It was really easy.

(music: Syd – “Shake Em Off”)

Chal Ravens

OK. So, that track produced... Co-produced with Hit Boy?

Syd

No, he did it himself. He did himself, yeah.

Chal Ravens

Oh. Full Hit Boy production.

Syd

Yeah.

Chal Ravens

Who obviously has a history of making hits. What was it like, working with a producer who’s had such huge commercial success, and did it change how you heard your own music at all?

Syd

I was really excited to work with him. I got the text from my A&R, like, “Hey, would you be down to work with Hit Boy?” And I was like, “The fuck?” [laughter] “When?” He’s super nice, super nice dude. Went to his studio, and he, like I said, just started playing those chords, and I was like, “Done.” He did some cool shit with the drum where he basically half-time the drums, and then turned that into the intro, and I was like, “OK, dope.” It was really cool watching him make the beat, and also really cool watching him actually play keys. He can play keys, and also cool because that’s not a typical 2017 beat. You know what I mean? That track, for me, kind of felt a little timeless, like, “Oh wow.” You couldn’t really put a date on this track, and I like stuff like that. So, I was really happy to work with somebody with a bunch of commercial success who wasn’t trying to make me anything commercial.

Chal Ravens

Did you think you were writing, potentially, for somebody else at that point?

Syd

Yeah. I definitely was writing... And honestly, it made the process a lot easier, not thinking about, “OK, this is for my album, this is... OK, I need it to be like this.” I was like, “Let me just write a song.” It could be for anything, for anybody. So, it was interesting, actually, going in with all these producers, because they’re like, “So, what’s good? You working on a album?” I was like, “Nah. Just writing songs,” and it turned into an album. It’s interesting.

Chal Ravens

Could you pick another producer off the album who you worked with where you had a really... Maybe quite a different experience?

Syd

Let me see what songs are on there. I don’t know, for the most part they were all similar experiences. I worked actually with one of Hit Boys production partners. He’s name is Haze[Banga]. And he produced “Got Our Own” and also “Over.” We did those in two different days. I think we did “Got Our Own” first. I went in there and I was like, “Oh, this would be tight for Post Malone.” [laughter]

You know whatever, and then I went in there the next time. His engineer wasn’t there the second time so I recorded it myself at his desk. And it was just very smooth, like he played me some beats, I was like, “That one,” and he went to the back of the room and just was like this [lounges back], and I just took over and it came together. Which is so similar but different where I didn’t watch him make the beat. But I kind of liked that like, “Play me some shit.” You know what I mean? If I don’t like anything then let’s make something new. Otherwise, like I'mma just pick one of your stash ones.

Chal Ravens

What about working with Nick Green who obviously comes from, well he’s a singer. What’s it like to work with another singer. Is it competitive?

Syd

Well, nah he’s one of my writing partners actually. So he wrote…

Chal Ravens

Well break down what that means in terms of working with a producer or working with a writer.

Syd

Well it’s interesting because he started producing like a couple years ago, and before that he had co-written a lot of Ego Death with me. The first song we wrote together was “Dontcha.” I actually was a fan of his, I was living with a friend named Aliya and she came home one day and was like, “Yo, I just went to this sick ass show, this band called Nicky Davey, you got to go to the next one.”

So she took me to the next one, and I was just blown away, this was before Feel Good and everything. I was just blown away. He was the lead singer, and his voice was just so fire and he’s got all these tattoos, and I’m like, “He’s like a tatted Justin Timberlake or something. It’s crazy, and his songs are so fire,” so I was just a fan. And I remember after the show, I saw him outside. And I said, “Hey man, big fan. We gotta work.” And he didn’t know who I was at the time and so he was just like, “OK, cool, whatever.” And then eventually I think, I don’t know how I got his information, but I invited him to my studio. We wrote “Dontcha,” and I just remember thinking like, “Damn, this is the one. This is the single for Feel Good, OK cool, like damn this is dope. All right. Dope.”

So then when Ego Death came around I was like, “Look let’s just keep it going, let’s just keep writing because we got something special.” So when he came to me with “Know,” we were like hella close, we’re still hella close. His dad was actually my voice coach for a few years, an amazing coach. And so he came to me with “Know,” and was like, “I wrote this song, man, like I think you’d sound dope doing it, just let me know.” He played it for me. I was like, “Yeah, all right, cool. Give it to me.”

Chal ravens

I wanted to, we can come back to the production of it, but I wanted to talk about your development as a singer as well. Did you always want to be a singer as a kid too? Or...

Syd

No, I always loved singing since I was a kid, but I never took lessons or anything, and I didn’t think I was a good singer. I had had a great way of memorizing runs though, and so I just, I remember being that one kid in the back of the car trying to sing all the runs. And all my friends being like, “Oh like you really trying to hit the notes, OK.” [laughter] And being kind of embarrassed like, “Oh damn, maybe I should stop.” And also my mom... Because I grew up. When growing up American Idol like was the thing and you watching TV and you watching all these people just sing terribly and be judged. You know what I mean? It was really intimidating. And I wasn’t really thinking about singing at the time, I was really trying to be a producer.

I didn’t really get into singing until we made our first Internet album. And at the time, we had a keyboard player named Tay Walker and he’s an artist, he’s a solo artist now. He was a solo artist then. And I used to record him, and I remember just vocal producing him on a light note. And just singing him what I had in mind for a harmony or whatever. And every so often he’d be like, “Hey man, like why don’t you sing it?” And I’d be like, “Man, because you’re the singer, bro.” And so for the longest I just stayed behind the desk. It wasn’t until I got a record deal that I started singing. And it was really intimidating coming out as a singer with no experience, because I felt like I was competing with all these people who’d been singing their whole lives. And that’s why I started a band because I was like, “I’m not about to get up here and sing with a DJ, like this is going to be really bad. So let’s get a band and bring some live music into it.”

And I started taking lessons with Nick’s dad, Don, and he was my coach until he passed away. And so now I don’t really have a coach now, I just kind of…

Chal ravens

What was the thing that made you decide to get a vocal coach? Was it just because you knew him?

Syd

Nah, I needed one. I was trash. My voice used to be really unstable, and still can be, but I’ve grown a lot. I’ve dedicated a lot of time to it. I was giving Nick free studio time at my studio for a while, and in exchange his dad gave me really, really cheap voice classes. So I was going to him every day. I’m not a very disciplined person on my own, so if I want to get better at something, and I’m not obsessed with it, you know what I mean? To be honest I wasn’t, I didn’t fall in love with singing until I got better at it, you know what I mean? Before that it was one of those things I loved to do, but it was so intimidating whenever you hit the wrong note, or you lose breath here or whatever, you just get discouraged.

So it took me having to say, “OK can I come Monday through Friday?” 30 minutes a day, Monday through Friday, I went and saw Don and he loved me. He said, he always called me his favorite student because I picked up kind of quick. But yeah I just needed to, I was touring. I was doing shows, and I wasn’t happy with my performances, so.

Chal Ravens

Did you used to worry about your voice then and how people kind of perceived it? Because now I mean it’s quite your, it’s your calling card in a way, it’s a very recognizable voice. So are you, do you hear it differently? Do you have a different relationship with it?

Syd

Yeah, I always knew I had a pretty voice, people always told me that. I knew if I have enough time to record it, I can make it sound good. I can make it sounds listenable. But for the longest, that’s why we didn’t perform the Internet songs. I think we dropped Purple Naked Ladies and we didn’t do a show until like nine months after because I just, I wasn’t up for it. I just didn’t have it in me. And even when we started doing it, I swear after every show the first thought in my head was, “What am I doing? I’m making a fool of myself.”

And I was for a very long time. I was making a fool of myself, but I don’t know what it was, maybe it was the fact that I had like four other guys now with me, and I’ve felt somewhat obligated to them to keep trying. You know what I mean? Not to give up because then we’re all out of a band. So I don’t know.

Chal Ravens

How’s the success, and critical success of Fin led other artists being in touch with you for work as a songwriter, as a collaborator. Do other people know about your collaborations?

Syd

Yeah, and at first it was bittersweet, because what I wanted was, “OK I’m gonna drop this album. I’m gonna show everybody that I can write these songs, like I can write songs like this and like this and then we got the Internet.” And I was hoping to get more work as a writer after that, but I had some artists hit me up to collaborate. At first, I was like, “I don’t wanna collab, I just wanna write you a song.” I had to realize that it’s a blessing. People like my voice. This is dope. I’ll get some shine from it, I guess, and it won’t hurt. I can still write my part, still be a songwriter.

Chal Ravens

Have you done that whole LA songwriting room thing where you’re brought in to bang out some songs to potentially be for another artist?

Syd

Yeah. I’ve done it a couple of times.

Chal Ravens

What’s that like?

Syd

I did a writing camp for French Montana once. It was fun. It was really fun.

Chal Ravens

Give us an idea…

Syd

I didn’t meet him at all. It’s interesting because I’ve had a publishing deal since I’ve had a record deal in 2011. Publishing deals are changing. The whole publishing industry is changing, but it wasn’t until this year that I had the opportunity to go into these writing camps and try to write hooks for these other artists and whatnot. They put you in a studio. They usually will put you in a compound, right? And they have like three studios rented out at the same time. They’ve got me, another songwriter, and two producers in this room. Two producers, three writers in that room, and then the actual artist is in the big room recording whatever they like.

That was an interesting process. What I liked about it was that I met a bunch of really cool producers and writers, and I realized that they’re all just as hungry as I am. I was in there with people who have hits, and they’re just trying to write more hits. They’re asking me, “How did you get a record deal? How did you become an artist?” A lot of them actually wanna be artists. And me, I’m like, “Well how did you get this number one because I just wanna write songs.” That was really cool realizing that…

Chal Ravens

Did any of your stuff get picked up?

Syd

No. Unfortunately. My second writing camp was for TI. He actually came in and recorded a verse over one of my hooks, which was really cool, but I haven’t heard it since. I know the producer though, so if I really wanna hear it again, I can ask for it. Ain’t no telling what’s gonna happen to that song. And it’s okay. I don’t have any of the songs that I wrote in any of those sessions. I think I wrote like four hooks in the French sessions, maybe like two or three for the TI ones, and I don’t have any of them, but it was great practice.

Chal Ravens

You have to give those up, right? You can’t use them yourself.

Syd

Well, if they don’t use them, I’m sure it’s fair game, but we have to wait to see if they wanna use them or not. It’s all good.

Chal Ravens

We’re gonna play “Body” from the album as well. Can you introduce that one for us a little bit?

Syd

[laughs] OK. “Body” was produced by MeLo-X. MeLo-X, he’s from New York. He produced on Beyoncé’s Lemonade album. He did a track or two on the Lemonade album. We have mutual friends, so I think we got connected through my A&R as well. Super cool dude. He came through to the house. “Body” was a beat that when I first heard it, I didn’t like it that much. And then I just let it play for some reason. I guess I was trying to understand it, and once I understood it and once I heard the top-line melody in my head, I was like, “Yo, this is gonna be a smash.” Body-roll anthem. Let’s get it. [laughs]

(music: Syd – “Body” / applause)

Chal Ravens

For a moment, I’d like to go back to when you were a kid, K-Y-D kid, I guess. You said before, I read that you heard things on the radio and you’d wanna take credit for them. That was when you realized that you wanted to write songs. What kind of tracks were they? Do you remember any specific ones that you thought I wish I’d written that?”

Syd

“Drop It Like It’s Hot.”

Chal Ravens

How old were you then?

Syd

I don’t even know. Was that middle school? Me and Justin went to middle school together. I don’t know. It was mostly like Neptunes’ beats that I would hear and be like, “Dang. I wish I could say I made this.”

Chal Ravens

Why do you think that is? What is it about a Neptunes beat that just speaks to you for some reason?

Syd

Maybe because they’re just really unique. I think at first it was the fact that... I don’t know what it is, but I like this song a lot and this song a lot and this song a lot. When I realized that they were all produced by the Neptunes, I was like, “Hmm. Well, what else did they make?” Now I’m a stan.

Chal Ravens

I think in that period, everything was written by the Neptunes, actually.

Syd

Yeah, and it was so inspiring because it wasn’t like typical industry-standard music production. You know what I mean? It was pushing boundaries. They were using synth guitars. You know what I mean? And making them sound good. That’s really hard to do. That’s not easy. It’s not easy at all. And not quantizing drums and stuff like that. That’s just very inspiring. Very inspiring.

Chal Ravens

You have some musical people in your family, as well. Your uncle is a reggae producer who co-wrote “Mr. Loveman” apparently. Is this true?

Syd

Yeah. [laughter]

Chal Ravens

How cool is that? You’d have a claim to fame anyway.

Syd

My uncle Mikey.

Chal Ravens

And your mum wanted to be a sound engineer as well?

Syd

My mom wanted to be an engineer, come to find out. My mom loves music, so she’s my biggest fan and my biggest critic at the same time, which is dope because she’s honest with me. When I’m trash, it sucks, but when I’m good, I know it’s actually good.

Chal Ravens

When you were growing up, when people were listening to music in your house, where they actually... People were listening at an analytical level, maybe, that you felt like people were listening closely and you learned that maybe?

Syd

Both. I think every weekend I would wake up to... Because we used to have surround sound in the whole house where my mom could plug... She had a 300-disc CD player. I know, 300. 300 CDs. She just kept them in there all the time, and every Saturday, Sunday morning I would wake up, and it’d be on shuffle throughout the whole downstairs.

Chal Ravens

What kind of stuff did she have?

Syd

Soul. R&B and soul mostly, and some reggae from my dad. I would wake up, she would be singing along to everything. I just grew up just listening to music a lot. My uncle Mikey, he was in Jamaica, so I wasn’t really in the studio or anything with him like that, but every time I went to Jamaica, I did spend most of my time in the studio. And that was really cool. That was when I realized I want a studio one day. This is cool. My uncle, now for the most part... The last time I went to Jamaica, we were at the studio five out of the seven days that I was there. Every day. He has a chef. He has a chef there. He sits outside on the patio under this little thing and just sits out there, talks to everybody that’s coming in and leaving, all these older reggae dudes coming in to rehearse. “Oh, Mikey. Wha gwan?” And then he’s like, “Ah”. He’s eating or whatever. You got younger artists coming in. “Are you Mikey Bennett?” They were trying to audition for him and stuff. That was just so cool. I’m just sitting there with my uncle, my dad, and people are just tripping over my uncle. That was really inspiring. Just sitting in the studio and watching the engineers just at the board. Yeah. It made me really wanna do it.

Chal Ravens

When you started making tracks for yourself, what did you start out with and how quickly did you feel the limitations of what you had? Did you move pretty fast in terms of learning?

Syd

I started with a MacBook Pro that my dad had bought for school used, and it had GarageBand on it. I was one day just going through all the programs to see what was on this computer. It was like the first computer we had had really in the house in a long time. I was just browsing, and I was like, “Oh shit. You can record music in here. You can put sounds on top of sounds and stuff.”

Justin was with me at the time. We were like 14 or something. LimeWire was really big back then [laughter]. We were downloading a lot of acapellas and stuff, and I was just trying to make beats over the acapellas. I don’t know if I picked up quick or anything because there was nobody around me really doing it, so there was no reference, but I became a little bit obsessed with it. My next-door neighbor, who’s like a brother to me, his name is Ty Ty, he raps. He had just gotten back home. He had moved away for like two years and came back and was still rapping. I was like, “That’s crazy because I can record you on my MacBook. We can make songs.”

So, we started recording just through the MacBook mic, and then I was like, “This sounds trash. Damn. Where do I get a microphone from?” I got one on Craigslist for like $90, and it was a small diaphragm condenser, which if you know about microphones, it’s not good for vocals, small diaphragm. It’s not the best for vocals, and I didn’t know. I was like, “Oh shit.” I got this Christmas money, I bought this mic, and then I’m like, “Fuck. How do I plug this into the MacBook?” So, I went to Guitar Center. I said, “Hey, how do I plug this into my MacBook?” They were like, “Oh, well, you need an interface.” I said, “What’s the cheapest one you have?” It was like 100 bucks for this M-Audio Fast Track.

The shit was so stupid. It didn’t have no phantom power in it, which you need to power a condenser microphone. I get the mic. I get the interface. I take it home, and my shit still don’t work. I’m like, “What the fuck?” I had to go back to Guitar Center, buy a separate box from phantom power. It’s fucking stupid. I set it up. I had a really big bedroom. My room was like two rooms connected, so I turned the smaller room into a studio. I put the mic in the closet, and I ran the wires all the way through the room and had like a whole studio set up in there for a cool year or two.

Eventually moved into my guest house when my cousin moved out of the guest house. Had a whole one bedroom apartment to use as a studio, and that’s where we recorded all the early Odd Future albums. Tyler’s first album, Earl’s first album.

Chal Ravens

I’m wondering if your mum would ever come and maybe have a go on your equipment when you’re not there.

Syd

Nah, she’s not very tech-savvy, but she does like to come in while I’m working and just sit and listen. “Oh, what’s that?” I’m like, “Oh, nothing.” I’m still real nervous sometimes to play music for my mom.

Chal Ravens

When you came across Tyler and Matt [Martians] on MySpace, right?

Syd

I met Matt on MySpace, yeah.

Chal Ravens

That’s how many years ago now? It’s like ten years ago?

Syd

Yeah, ten, 11.

Chal Ravens

Which is a long time to be working with people, and I wondered, really, what are the most important lessons that you’ve learned from them, but also what do you think they’ve learned from you? What have you discovered about each other as your key talents as songwriters and rappers and producers?

Syd

Let’s see, what I’ve learned from Matt... a lot of life lessons from Matt. Matt was there for me when I was struggling really bad with depression and was on tour and didn’t wanna be on tour. I honestly didn’t want to be alive at the time, and he was always there just to bring me back. Like, “Look, don’t trip. You gon’ be home soon. It’s all good. We gon’ make this album. It’s gon’ be cool.”

Musically, I think from Matt I learned that anything can be done. Anything is possible. I think why I reached out to Matt on MySpace all those years ago was he had the Super 3. I thought it was three people, just like everybody else, because he was drawing. He didn’t post pictures, just drawings of him and two other people. It was the Super 3. It was his production group, and I wanted to have a production group too, because I was making beats, but I wasn’t very happy with them. I was like, “Man.” I hit him up for advice on MySpace. Like, “Hey man, I’m a huge fan. Can I ask you for advice?” He was like, “Oh that’s dope. You’re a girl. You make beats that’s dope.” And I was like, “Yeah, man. I want a production partner though, because I just have a hard time finishing my beats.” He was like, “But then you’d have to split the money.” I was like, “Damn, that’s true. OK, well let me get better at this shit then.” Ironically, we became production partners.

But yeah, I learned from him, like throw another layer on it. Fuck it. It sounds weird, but it sounds different, right? I think what made Purple Naked Ladies so special was that when we made it, we knew that we had never heard anything like it before. We made it. We knew it was weird and quirky, but we were like, “Yo, this don’t sound like nothing. That’s tight, right? It’s cool. Is that a good thing? It is a good thing, yeah.” I think from him, I guess the biggest lesson I learned was that making something unique is good. As producers, as artists, it’s easy to get caught up in what everyone else is making because you see it work for them. But what I’ve realized, even recently with Fin, is that a unique body of work can be more valuable than a good non-unique body of work.

Chal Ravens

What about… What you think they’ve learned from you?

Syd

Hmm. Shoot, I don’t know. Gotta ask them. I don’t know. Maybe... Probably nothing. I don’t know. No idea. That’s a good question, though.

Chal Ravens

As Odd Future got successful, how did that change your work as a producer? How did your studio change? How did you develop, other than getting more proficient, I guess? Was there a pressure of knowing that more people were listening?

Syd

Naw. It was... I don’t know. I was really inspired working with Odd Future. At the time, I was making beats, but I wouldn’t play them for anybody. I would come in the studio and Left Brain would be making three beats at the same time, and I was like, “Yo, this is tight. Imma try that.” I’d come in, and Tyler would be making a beat real quick, and I would just take notes. Like, OK, he did that. OK, that’s dope.

For the most part, I just realized what I actually wanted to do, and that was produce and create and facilitating other people’s dreams was dope, and being a part of other people’s journeys was dope, but I realized that I wanted to have my own journey as an artist, as a creator, and that was valuable.

Chal Ravens

You’re obviously really young when things exploded. I guess I wondered if you feel like there’s enough industry support for people who get signed when they’re really young?

Syd

I think there’s more industry support for young artists than there is for older ones. The industry, it’s very complicated, and it’s changing so quickly every day. I’m 25, and a lot of times I feel really old in this industry, and that’s so sad. Yeah. It’s weird, you know. You have a lot of young artists pop up seemingly out of the blue sometimes, and then you dig a little deeper and realize, oh, they’re not random at all. They’ve been doing this for a minute. And then there are other artists who pop up seemingly out of the blue, and you look into their shit, and you’re like, wait, is this their first song and it’s already... Who are they signed to?

The new thing, I think, for labels is to try to make your new artist out to be independent, because people seem to gravitate more towards independent artists these days, I guess. It’s a really interesting game right now. And like it said, it’s changing so quickly all the time you kind of have to think ten steps ahead.

Chal Ravens

We’re gonna play one last song, and then open up some questions, so you have time to think of them. We’re gonna play “Flashlight” from 2011, and it would be great if you could introduce it for us and maybe get back in the head space you were at when you wrote that one.

Syd

Damn. OK, so, Justin was there for this. “Flashlight” is a song that I wrote and produced when I was 16. It’s one of those things, I made the beat, I think, one evening. I was in bed getting ready to fall asleep, and the lyrics just came to me. I wrote them down. I woke up in the morning and recorded them, and then I called Justin and was like, “Yo, come through.” I hopped in the shower. I got out of the shower, he was already in the room, like, “So, what’s good?” I was like, “I wanna play you this song that I did.”

Chal Ravens

What was his reaction?

Syd

He said it was tight. He was like, “Yo, this is tight.” I was like, “Hey, thanks man. Appreciate it. All right.” I was inspired. This was right when Drake’s came out. I was inspired by Drake. He’s a GOAT. Definitely one of the GOATs.

(music: Syd Tha Kyd – “Flashlight” / applause)

Chal Ravens

Can we give it up to Syd please.

[applause]