Ice-T

Jeff Mao

Tonight, we welcome an LA hip-hop pioneer, but more importantly, not just an LA hip-hop pioneer, but a pioneer in expanding what the possibilities are for a hip-hop artist. He is not just an MC, but a band leader, author, actor, broadcaster, public speaker, freedom of expression advocate… Please join me in welcoming the OG Ice T. [applause]

Ice-T

Cool.

Jeff Mao

Thank you for being here.

Ice-T

Yeah, yeah. I was minding my business and Egyptian Lover popped up on the phone talking about coming to LA, and I’m like, “I live in New York right now,” and he’s like, “Well, come. We’re gonna do an Uncle Jamm’s Army reunion.” Of course I wanted to do that, so when there’s a will, there’s a way, and you guys came up with this little speaking thing for the Red Bull Academy, so I’m in the building.

Jeff Mao

All right, well, we’re very happy to have you here. Now, I just ran down a short list of the many things that you do, but do you still consider yourself a musician first?

Ice-T

Yeah, I think I’m a musician first. More of a writer, whether I’m writing books or writing raps, or just a lyricist and a writer first. Bottom line hustler, bottom line [laughter]. Bottom line hustler. That just was a vehicle for me to get out of trouble, so I had to figure something out and that kind of was dropped in my lap. I always had a gift of gab. I was always a good conversationalist. I was always good at that, and sometimes, you don’t know what’s gonna be your gift and that turned out to be my gift, my communication ability.

Jeff Mao

Do you think that being the foundation for you, do you think that was the thing that prepared you for everything that you were able to do subsequently? Musically, theatrically, whatever, writing, or do you think hip-hop was part of that, as well, as far as just giving you the skills, preparing you to be able to do all these different things?

Ice-T

Well, I was just always a deep thinker. I was always trying to figure it out. I’m an orphan. I don’t have any living relatives, so I was kind of thrown into south central Los Angeles to try to figure it out. You got the gangs over here. You got the hustlers. You got the girls. You gotta figure out. I don’t got no backup, so I don’t have family or brothers, so I gotta connect to the right cats that got my back. I’m light-skinned. I got light eyes. My name’s Tracy [laughter].

You trying to make it in this city, these motherf-----s will eat you alive, you dig? I always was trying to figure it out. I was always reaching to be a little bit smarter, a little bit more intelligent. You don’t have to be in the gang. You just gotta get the gang on your side. If you’re a likable person, you can move around, so I figure early in LA that no one’s afraid of anybody, but if they love you, you good, so love is more important than fear.

All of my friends that people feared are dead because that don’t last, but if people like you... See, OK, say I got a close group of friends around me that love me, right, then they talk well about me to another circle of friends and they talk well about me to another circle of friends, so when Joe Blow over here says he’s gonna move on Ice, he’s gonna run into somebody that says, “Nah, I f---s with Ice,” and that protects me.

Now, when you’re in danger is when your closest circle turns on you and they open the door to the second level that can come get you, so it’s very important you make sure the people really close to you are happy and ain’t in that zone, but I figured all this stuff out and I was trying to figure out what to do in LA and I wanted to be popular. I wanted to be cool, and music was never ever... I can’t sing. I can’t play any instrument, so I never thought that was ever gonna be... Acting, all this stuff I’m doing now is so far from what I thought my life was gonna be.

Jeff Mao

Right. You mentioned being an orphan coming to Los Angeles. What are your memories of Fort Crenshaw and how that…

Ice-T

My memories of what?

Jeff Mao

What you call Fort Crenshaw, which is Crenshaw High School.

Ice-T

Crenshaw was crazy. I came to LA. My mother died, then my father died, and I came out here in the seventh grade, and I lived in an upscale black community called View Park, which is up Angeles Vista and where Vernon... That’s where I started. We got bused to Palms Junior High School, so they were busing us in Gompers out the Palms. The first thing I learned out there in Culver City was the white girls loved black dudes. We got off the bus and we were like the Jackson 5 out there. We was like, “Yo, f--k, busing ain’t so bad, you know?”

We learned that quickly, and the white kids over there didn’t hate us. They liked us. We was cool. We was good. We were just cool. It wasn’t any racial tension. The only tension was getting on that bus early in the morning and that extra hour and all that shit, so after that when I got to ninth grade, back then you would do 10th, 11th and 12th in high school. Well, summer school I decided, well, I’m gonna go to Crenshaw because I could walk to Crenshaw, but I don’t know none of them motherf-----s down in the hood. I’m up in the hills, so I don’t know nobody right across Crenshaw. Now, they got front hood and back hood 60, but they didn’t have that. Once you on the other side of Crenshaw, there wasn’t no gangs, so I decide I’m gonna go to Crenshaw and I walked there in the ninth grade summer school, and I was like, “God damn.” These kids was from Horsman, Bathune, [inaudible], and they was another level. They was tough as a motherf----r, so I was like, “OK, cool. What I’m gonna do is I’m gonna align myself with the shot callers,” and because, like I said, I got the gift of gab and I was little, I was able to do that, so I figured out who was gonna be the Hoover Crips and all that, so I knew all them.

These are the years of Tookie, so everybody is connected and stuff, but I figured out that I join any gang, I made myself the enemy of another gang, so I would just become a gang affiliate. I f----d with different n---s and different sets, mostly Crips. Crenshaw, you could get your f-----g shit beat out of you. That place was not to be f----d with. It was very dangerous. First thing I learned when I got to high school, though, was all the girls were going with n---s with beards that wasn’t but 20 years old and shit, so I’m there in the 10th grade. I’m trying to hook up with the girls and shit, especially the cheerleaders. After school, you’d watch the lowriders pick up, these big-ass, grown-ass men. I’m like, “F--k, why am I even saying anything to her?” F-----g grown 40-year-old n---a just picked her up [laughter]. First few years of high school, I wasn’t getting no pussy. Wasn’t nothing happening, but that’s where I started getting infected with this hustler/player shit because the cats I was hanging with was shooting dice and wearing tailors. People out of this city don’t even know what tailors are. That’s like young kids. We used to go downtown and get tailor-made clothes. Vegas, Vee’s, and [inaudible], and some… Pimp shit. You’re 15, 16 with pimp clothes on, right? [laughter] Motherf-----s know Dutch boys and all that old shit. We would go to school and one of my partners, Michael Carter, rest in peace, they had these Iceberg Slim books, so I started getting into those books, and I was like, “Yo, this is some of the flyest shit in the history of the world.” Next thing you know, I had an afro. If you look at my pictures, I had an Afro. Oh, before I knew, I had a lot of body in that shit and magnetic rollers and the perm was, you start reading that pimp shit next thing you know your shit is like... So my shit was more wavy than the ships in the Navy. You dig what I’m saying? [laughter]

I would go to Good Fred’s on Western, I think it was Western. I think 5448. It’s on 54th, right there. Get my hair did. I used to go to home room with rollers in my hair. This is how Crenshaw was. I would go with rollers. I wouldn’t take my motherf-----g curls out till nutrition [laughter]. On a funky bitch, you dig? So I’m trying to figure this out. My high school friends is here, they know. You could come to school in house shoes. It was crazy. It was crazy, but 100% black. There was not one... I think there was one little Mexican kid that was there. Now it’s more 50-50. Was no Mexicans. Only white people were the teachers.

And then Crenshaw, our arch enemies was Manual Arts and Dorsey. Cougars had a rep. Crenshaw High School is like the most central high school in LA. Like if you took south central LA and put a needle through the map of the center, you’d come through the Crenshaw quad, that school. It’s like an even mix of west side. See, east side of LA is on the other side of the harbor freeway. We don’t really f--k with east side n---s. East side n---s wear like shorts and hard shoes and party socks [laughter]. Like, right? n---s be having Stacys on with a sweatsuit and shit. That’s some east side. That shit over there, by Locke and Jordan. That’s some other shit, there’s a different kind of gangsters.

Are you from here?

Jeff Mao

I am not, no.

Ice-T

OK. Well, people say Compton. Compton is so far from LA you need a full tank of gas to get to Compton. And Compton, you can ride a horse, you can have pigs, you can have chickens and shit in Compton. So south central cats and Inglewood cats, we like, because Eazy-E and N.W.A made Compton popular. But whenever you’re across anyone from LA, they go, “I’m from LA,” if you black they go, “You from Compton?” You’re like, “Naw, I ain’t from motherf-----g Compton. I’m from south central LA You dig?” But yeah. I made it through Crenshaw.

I used to be in a locking group. At that time, breakdancing hadn’t really broke, so the big group out here on the west coast was the lockers. Shabba Doo, Don Campbell, Freeway. I had a little crew called the West Coast Locksmiths, and we used to lock, and just anything to keep the gang bangers off your bumper. You know what I’m saying? It’s like, “Wattup crip? Wattup cuz? Oh, that n---a dance. OK, cool.” It’s like yeah. I’m amongst it, but I’m not really trying to get down like that. I knew there was something else. But by having affiliations with the right cats, you could survive.

Jeff Mao

Right, right. I mean, you mentioned somebody who was a profound influence on you. I want to play a little bit of audio of this gentleman’s work. Just for a minute.

[music: Iceberg Slim – “Durealla”]

Ice-T

That’s Iceberg Slim.

Jeff Mao

Make some noise for Iceberg Slim, please. [applause]

Ice-T

Lot of people don’t know, Iceberg made an album, which he didn’t rhyme, which that’s from the album Reflections. See, and the thing with Iceberg Slim was he told stories, but it was the front, the A and the B side of the game. It wasn’t always you win, you lose. Because that’s what the game really is. It’s not a always win situation. All my friends in the penitentiary and all of them dead, I know there’s a B side to this game. So my thing was if I’m going to talk about the streets, I got to show you both sides of it.

I had an epiphany because I was admiring Iceberg Slim and I’m trying to do everything. I’m trying to pimp. I remember when the girls that we used to have that we used to boost with us, we had girls that boost with us and girls we steal jewelry with, and then I decide I tried to pimp on them and they was trying to run like a motherf-----r. They was like, “Oh, Ice is trying to pimp on me.” I’m like, “Come on, baby, you sitting on 20,000. You got to come on.” So I’m trying to push them that way. Pimping is difficult. [laughter]

Jeff Mao

Some have said it ain’t easy.

Ice-T

I’m really just trying to do what I’m admiring, this hustling and this game and people say, “Well, you cut for this, you got light eyes and you’re not really fascinated.” I’m not really fascinated with pussy if it’s not aimed at me. It’s like you could have a bunch of guns in this room, but if they’re not aimed at me I’m not worried about it. All the women can have all the pussy in the world, but if that shit’s not aimed at me, like it’s coming for me, f--k it. It’s not my pussy. [laughter] I could be around a lot of girls and they don’t fascinate me. I’m like cool, you know? You just want me to hit on you so you can laugh about it, but I’m not hitting on you unless I know you trying to f--k me, for real.

But anyway [laughter]. One day I got this epiphany, I’m like, “Iceberg Slim isn’t just a pimp and a player, he’s a writer.” He’s a writer. There’s so many hustlers and players in the world, but who knows their name? I’m not going to be known, because players have these dreams of, like Cube says, “Looking at the Goodyear blimp,” and parades. This is the delusions that players have. I was like, if I’m going to be known, if I want to go down in the books, I can’t just live the game, I have to document the game. And that’s how I’m going to be known about the average cat on the street. There’s a lot of Ice-Ts out here. They just ain’t made no records. They just ain’t wrote no books. So I said I’ll document the game. When you listen to my music, don’t listen to it like a rap record. Listen to it like me telling you stories over music. But it’s not meant to dance to. We intentionally used beats that you couldn’t dance to, because you’re supposed to sit back and listen to me kick game. That’s what all my records are about.

Jeff Mao

I mean, yeah. That makes complete sense, actually. Because I was going to ask you, at some point in this conversation, sort of the conventional musical format of a certain era of hip-hop from this city is like P-Funk style beats and things like that. You’ve consciously shied away from that.

Ice-T

Consciously.

Jeff Mao

Yeah.

Ice-T

Once I find out something’s easy, I don’t want to do it no more. Chuck D says Ice-T is the only person he knows that does things that jeopardize his entire career, to stay awake. “I’m Your Pusher” was the first rap record with a singing hook. It was a hit. I never did it again. Because “I’m Your Pusher” had a Curtis Mayfield hook, and it hit, I thought it was cheating. I’m like, “That’s too easy. I can’t, f--k that, no more singing hooks.”

Because I just think it’s too easy. And I’m not going to do something I see somebody else do. So I’m trying, because real players, you want to be original. I want to pop open some shit you never seen. I want to introduce you to things. If I pop up in this motherf-----g Gucci jacket and a n---a in the front row got one on, I’m going to burn this shit backstage [laughter]. You dig? Because that ain’t fly. It’s like them shits was on sale, son. What’s happening? My music always steered away from what normal people was trying to do. It always had to have its own lane. It always had to sound different.

Jeff Mao

When did cats start calling you Ice? Iceberg Slim was obviously an inspiration to you.

Ice-T

Ice comes from, “Save some more of that ice stuff T,” because I wasn’t letting people call me Tracy. They would call me Tray, they called me Crazy Tray. Tracy starts fights. I go in a new neighborhood, they like, “Oh Tracy? n---a that’s a bitch name.” I gotta swing on a n---a I just met, you know? [laughter] I never really had no problem. I’m six feet tall, 210, I’m not worried about nobody. You know what I’m saying? I’m not a little guy that’s worried. I’ll get busy. I just try to avoid conflict. So we took the Tray and it turned into T, and then people you say, say some more of that Ice stuff, T. Ice-T is really Iceberg T. My real homies call me Berg. Bishop Juan said, “n---a, you Ice, Iceberg. n---a, you know that name is wanted in the streets. N---s want to be Ice, everybody wants to be Ice, n---a. But you got that name and you got a brag n---s can’t shut you down, n---a. You got it, that’s your name until you gone, motherf----r.” I named my son little Ice. His name is ICE with all capital letters because he doesn’t have a name, he has a title. Yeah, church. You know, the key to being ice cool is when you win, you don’t get that happy. When you lose you don’t get that sad. It’s like, “Ice, you just won the lotto,” I’m like, “Word.” “Ice, somebody just wrecked your car,” “Damn.” [laughter] That’s how you become Ice, you dig?

Jeff Mao

So when did the actual hip-hop style of rhyming… You say you were kicking the street rhymes…

Ice-T

Hip-hop, hip-hop started for me, after I came out the military. I went in the military because I was a teen parent. I came home and the two things was happening. The dance situations with Bay 5, Wreckin’ Cru, Uncle Jamm’s. Shit was popping off. And my homies who had gone from small time criminals to big time criminals, and they say, “Look man, we stealing, we hitting these jewelry spots. This is the lick, this is what you do.” I was from the military so I had no training but for that shit. I’m like, “All right, come on, let’s go get money.” While we getting money, we would get the money, and then we would go to these parties. Then because we was getting so much money, we was the best dressed motherf-----s at the party.

When you would go to Uncle Jamm’s Army, you would see somebody like Ice-T show up with 40 people, girls and guys, all Fila draped head to toe, with the jewels on and the perms popping. You like, “What are these, are these some hybrid gangster-pimp-hustler-young LA players?” That’s where it started. I wanted to do parties like them, and I found out that I would get more attention from these little rhymes I had written. You got to remember, nobody had ever made no money rapping yet. No one had bought a car rapping yet. When I tell my friends I want to rap, they like, “N---a you better get this money man, all that old rap bullshit.” N---s talk down on it. I was like, “Cool.” I remember I would still go to Uncle Jamm’s Army and I would ask Rodger [Clayton] and stuff like that. Eventually they let me get on the mic. I went up there saying whatever I had to say. That was my first taste of standing in front of large audiences.

Jeff Mao

Today’s been declared Uncle Jamm’s Army day in Los Angeles, all right. What did Uncle Jamm’s Army mean? What does it mean to this city? How important was that movement?

Ice-T

You got to remember, back then even for adults, there weren’t a lot of clubs like now, you have lots of clubs, night clubs and things like that. There weren’t and if you were 16 to 21, you couldn’t get in it. Well, 20 you couldn’t get into a club. If you was black, and even 20, you wasn’t getting into the Hollywood clubs. You had a few places you could go. They tapped the market that was... The other option is a house party. And a house party in LA is a potentially death trap, because basically what you do in a house party, most people out here that have houses, the house party is in the garage, and it’s in the back, and they put the turntables back there, and then they have red lights and shit. That whole driveway is a kill zone. It’s dangerous, right. The motherf-----s drive by and they blast in that driveway, you can get it. Very few people even let you into their house.

When we was in high school, they would take these index cards, and it would say, date, gate, mate, rate, and late. Date is where, gate is... I mean, the date is when, the gate is where, the mate is who’s throwing it, and the rate is how much it costs. Then they would have a name of a song at the top, like Big Payback. I’m not going to that f-----g party [laughter]. Shit’s called the Big f-----g Payback. They would hand out these index cards and that’s where the parties would be. This is before the flyers. When Uncle Jamm’s Army came out, all of the sudden you start seeing these flyers up on the post of the streets. Then they had radio commercials. You knew it wasn’t a house party. Then once you went to one, it was more girls and more action than ever.

The one thing about an Uncle Jamm’s Army party is it was not a concert. See, if you go to a concert, you come in like this, and you expect people to perform. Uncle Jamm’s was a dance. You went there to catch. There were girls there, and there were guys there, so you’re out there trying to pick up. It was more of a mating situation going on out there, than a... If you go to a concert tonight, you ain’t expecting to meet nobody unless you finna play the parking lot, you dig what I’m saying, or the girls bathroom, some old pimp shit, I know how [laughter]. Give you all n----s secrets and shit. The best place to pick up chicks is in front of the girls bathroom at any club. Just stand there, you gone get to see them in the white light, they probably left they man for a hot second, and if you intercept them right there, you can get more numbers then you just work the averages [laughter]. Just stand there. Don’t waste your time running through the whole club. Just stand right by the girls bathroom [applause]. But you got to pose to be chose. You got to be fly, you got to catch them looking first, you dig? When they look a little too long, you say, “Bitch, I’m in a orange suit, you know, I ain’t no UPS man. What’s happening?” [laughter] That’s another game. Back to this.

Uncle Jamm’s Army was a dance, not a concert. It’s the music played continuously. The dance floor was just packed with people. Back then they was doing the freak, which is basically just dry humping to a rhythm. Love the freak, run that back. Some n----s is still doing the freak. Some n----s done never learned no new dances, that’s all they know is just the freak. They come to the party to push up on you.

Jeff Mao

Now, there’s always this documentation of New York hip-hop history, where it’s the cats from uptown came downtown to do parties and that’s where you have this scenes intermingling. Was there an equivalent of that in LA?

Ice-T

No, in New York you had the hip-hop scene which went downtown to the upscale people, Andy Warhol and people like that got ahold of it. They had a thing out there where they called a truce with the street gangs in order to party. That’s what the Zulu Nation did. We said, “Look, we’re not going to be able to have these parties if y’all act up.” That’s one thing we know about clubbing is that once somebody gets shot, or something happens the girls stop coming. That’s the end of the party. Ain’t no party with a bunch of dudes, you know what I’m saying, ain’t going to happen. We used to run clubs, we had clubs up in Hollywood later. Water The Bush, United Nation, and I used to tell them that this club is based on pussy per square foot, you dig? If you stock the pond with enough women, the guys are going to come. If we put ugly girls in this club, they gone buy beer. If you put hot chicks they buy champagne. This is basic business here y’all, ya don’t understand. The girls get in free because they don’t spend money anyway, and the guys pay to impress.

When you take it down to a high school level, you still need a lot of girls. Girls ain’t coming where somebody could get hurt. They like, “Nah, nah, I’m cool.” You have to keep a lid on the nonsense. Here’s the problem. Everybody in LA don’t go everywhere in LA, right. See, I’m sitting in Inglewood, I don’t come to Inglewood ’cos I got all this blue on. You understand what I’m saying? We from another part of LA. Different people won’t cross different lines. If you from Compton, they never cross Manchester. Compton is 10 square miles. People stay in they little sectors in California, especially the guys. When Uncle Jamm’s threw a party, it was so big, it would draw people from all the different neighborhoods, all different gang sets. You have a potential powder keg.

Jeff Mao

Well what about Radio? Because this is one of the places that you really made your home.

Ice-T

Oh, now Radio’s a whole ’nother thing. The Radio was a club down by MacArthur Park that was run by a Russian named Alex Jordanoff and a white guy named KK and they were the first club that really played hardcore hip-hop to upscale white, kind of new wave crowd. Glove played there. Glove, my DJ who played on the song “Reckless,” he played there. Egyptian Lover spun there. But they would bring New York acts. And that’s also where they shot the movie Breaking. That was a real scene. But when the movie company came in, they didn’t want to pay Alex and call it the Radio so they called it the Radiotron. That’s that Hollywood bullshit and they figured a way to cut him out of what he created. But it was the first really hardcore New York-ish hip-hop club in LA

Now Uncle Jam’s Army wasn’t playing rap because there was no rap records. They were playing techno. So I called Uncle Jamm’s like the first rave. They were doing a rave and didn’t know what it was. It was all DJs and local DJs who were really nobodies but became stars in the world of Uncle Jamm’s Army. Egyptian Lover just told me the night he became Egyptian Lover. I’m like, “Wow.” It was a very erotic experience that turn him into Egyptian Lover. He was like, “I’m the Egyptian motherf-----g Lover right now.” So people were being born in there.

Jeff Mao

Well, when do you feel like you really started to find your voice then as an MC? I mean, we know the track that sort of set it off but…

Speaker: Ice-T

I didn’t know what I was doing. I was just trying to get out of trouble. I seen rap as a vehicle. I saw Run DMC play and they had lasers and I was like, “Yo, this shit is rock & roll. This is gon’ be big.” This is me only playing in garages. So when I saw somebody... See, when somebody takes it to another level, it lets everyone else know there is another level. A lot of kids may never have thought of acting and then they see me acting and then they go, “Damn. That’s somethin’ I could do.” When Barack Obama became president, it’s like, “Damn. That can be reached.” We put these limits but there’s really no limit. I mean, speaking of acting, they told me the other day, they said, “Do you know you’re the longest running black actor in television history?”

Jeff Mao

Wow.

Ice-T

I was like, “How the f--k did that happen?” But 19 years on SVU.

Jeff Mao

That’s amazing.

Ice-T

It’s amazing. So I don’t know. I started making records... I did one record called “The Coldest Rap.” It was all right. Then I got with Unknown DJ who was another guy that was part of the scene and Unknown, I was trying to get him to do a record on Hen Gee and Evil E, my DJs and stuff. He was like, “You gotta do a song. You gotta do a song.” So I did a song called “Ya Don’t Quit.” Then I did another song and my boy Randy Mac was like, “Talk that shit you be talkin’ though. F--k this hip-hop shit. Talk that shit.” I’m like, “Nobody wants to hear that shit.” That’s when we did “6 In The Mornin’.” [applause]

The B side wins again, “6 In The Mornin’” is just an adventure of one person’s journey but it’s really... I write faction. It’s a fictional story using factual occurrences but the occurrences could’ve happened from a lot of different people, but it makes a good adventure. So all the things in the story happened but maybe not to me but Ice-T lived this adventure. I knew this song was a hit because I got a call from the Fillmore West in the Bay and they were like, “Yo, would you do a concert?” I’m like, “I only got one song.” They like, “Nah, nah. They feelin’ you up here in the Bay. They know all your music. They playin’ you on KMEL,” and all this. I’m like, “Word?” I’m like, “OK, cool.” Then four days later, they called me back and they said, “We want you to do another concert.” I’m like, “I just signed up to do one.” They said, “That’s sold out.” I’m like, “Are you kiddin’ me? I just sold out a show?”

LA is a weird place. You could be famous but they won’t let you know it. [laughter] They like, “I know this n---a. This n---a went to school with my cousin. F--k him. He ain’t no star. I see this n---a standin’ in front of the liquor stores and shit. F--k him.” [laughter] But then you go to the Bay, they rolling the carpet out for you because you... First off, they love the LA n----s. Then you coming in there. I’m selling out shit. So that’s something you have to adjust to when you from LA. LA don’t really break artists. LA is really hard. They usually wait for you to break somewhere else and then they claim you. Like “Oh, Kendrick Lamar, he’s the biggest artist in Texas and shit. That’s us! That’s us!” He’s from LA, you motherf-----s. They’ll claim you. But here, they front on you. LA people know. So yes, “6 In The Mornin’” was my first big hit.

[music: Ice-T – “6 In The Mornin’” / applause]

The funny thing is now when I do performances and I got to come out, I got to come out, I got to go, “Six in the mornin’, police at my door.” I got to find that voice. “Fresh Adidas squeak across the bathroom floor.” “Out my back!” I got to go there. [laughter]

Jeff Mao

I was going to ask you about that actually. You have this register. I mean, I guess it’s for different songs and different materials which voice you decide to employ, right?

Ice-T

Yeah. You know, when you’re a solo artist, your voice is an instrument. So the worst thing is listen to a solo rapper’s album where every song sounds the same. So I can yell on some records. Like songs like “You Played Yourself” or “High Rollers,” I’m kind of using this voice. [changes voice] “This is it. Dope from the fly kid. The ice mic is...” So you got to have all... Because you try to match the voice to the energy of the song so that’s essential to me.

Jeff Mao

When you described in your pre-professional music days doing what you were doing, robbing jewelry stores, whatever it was, you mentioned the adrenaline rush.

Ice-T

Yeah.

Jeff Mao

That was unlike anything else. But how is performing? How did that relate to that? What was…

Speaker: Ice-T

That was different. This shit is not... Nothing’s like that. Nothing. I mean, if you ever... I’m sorry to say it but there’s nothing that’s going to give you the rush of putting your life on the line. So when you moving through a store, you holding people ransom and shit, this shit is some other shit! You on some ole... Whooo! You know? And then when it’s over, you’re like, “Damn.” Hopefully you get away but, no, a lot of criminals are hooked on that high. There’s a rush that goes along with that but I’m cool with not having that rush no more. I’m cool. I said I’ve completed my PhD in testing the system and I lived to tell and I got away with enough felonies for everybody in this room so I’m cool. I’m not going to break the law. I don’t break the law. I don’t jaywalk in New York. I’m going to tell you right now, I’m not a religious person. What I do know is something’s going on. I don’t know what it is but I know there’s something going on. I’m afraid to pick a religion because I don’t want to end up in heaven or whatever and a Hare Krishna guy says, “Remember me in that f-----’ airport? You f-----’ asshole.” So I don’t know which one, so I ain’t picking one. But I know something is going on. But I believe honestly now, the way my life has changed, that if I break the law or I cross you or even lie to you with the intent to take advantage of you, I’ll die. I believe I’ll suffer instant karma. Because, I got away. I’m so lucky in my life today. I got a beautiful kid. I got a beautiful life. For me to go back in that dark world, I can’t do it. I can do it with my music. I can revisit those thoughts and the ways of thinking, ‘cause they’re very familiar to me. But I don’t want that. I’m in search of peace. I’m in search of helping my friends.

But I also tell people, the funk... That part, I’m very familiar with that and seasoned in that too. So, if you choose to go there, you f-----g with a vet in that department. You understand? But that’s not what I wish. I like to just be around people that I love and positive energy now.

Jeff Mao

When did you first learn about the existence of a parental advisory sticker?

Ice-T

Well, back when we were put... That was by the time I had got my record deal and I was at Warner Brothers. And they come at me and they go, you know, they got the PMRC, Tipper Gore is out there saying rap records are f-----g up people and the same bullshit that been going on seen the birth of rock & roll. I was like, “Whatever.” They said, “They wanna put a sticker on the record to let people know that there’s bad words,” or whatever. I was like, “Cool.” My thing was I was never trying to bait and switch you. I’m never trying to sell you something and then you’re shocked. My attitude is if you open up a Stephen King novel and the cover is a body with a knife in it, don’t get mad when you turn the first cover and somebody gets whacked. I mean, that’s... So my album covers had guns and imagery of street shit. So, do not enter. The album cover says don’t enter if this is not what you want. Don’t become offended. So, I didn’t mind a sticker. But it was the first record ever stickered, another first.

Jeff Mao

Right. I mean, do you think that... Let me ask it this way... When you found your voice as an artist doing music that documented the streets, did you know immediately by necessity that you were gonna have to be dropping knowledge within that fabric?

Ice-T

Oh. Once I found out that people liked that, I was like, “Oh man,” it’s like I hit a home run. I got an abundance of this shit. I could do this shit all motherf-----g day, you know? It was gonna be harder for me to rap like a rapper, to rap about parties and bullshit that didn’t matter to me. That shit was... how many records could I make about that? That’s why now you listen to the rappers, they like, “I got a car, I got a watch, I got a car, I got a watch. Check this out, I got a watch, I got a car.” [laughter] You know? “I f----d a girl, I got a car. I f----d a watch. I got a car.” [laughter]

Because they ain’t... you know, “I’m in the kitchen, I’m cooking birds.” They have a small amount of experience. So, there’s lack of content. So, I would read a lot of books. I’m watching movies. I’m trying to take in... Like even after... Right before I make a record, I’m taking in all the information I can so that I’m able to express a lot of knowledge. But because I had been in the game. You gotta remember, I started rapping when I was 27. I was no kid. So from 18 to 27, I was on the street. So, I had real shit to talk about.

That’s why I listen to these little n----s say, “Yeah, I’m 14.” N---a, you ain’t never even, only bird you saw was at Popeye’s n---a, like stop it. They ain’t been in no...Get the f--k outta here. A lot of Scarface shit. So, you know... And then I also come from a zone where the n----s that was around me wouldn’t allow me to lie. So, I got homies that really been there. And n----s tell me, “Ice, you ain’t gotta lie because the shit we did was too real.” So keep it within the realms of reality. You ain’t got to say you killed 50 n----s. You ain’t killed 50 n----s, you probably would, but you haven’t. So don’t say it. I kind of, like, didn’t know you could lie. I didn’t know you could take pictures with girls that weren’t yours. I didn’t know you could stand in front of cars that weren’t yours. I didn’t know you could wear other people’s jewelry. I didn’t know that was okay. I thought like... That’s not allowed in the street. n----s like, “N---a that ain’t your rope n---a.” Like come on n---a. Like what’s good? So, I was always reaching for being real. It was imperative. It’s paramount. We can’t fake the funk. Somebody will check you. And you know, for me to be from LA and to be doing this shit so long, and never have been challenged. You’ve never heard nobody come out at me, ever. That says a lot ‘cause n----s know. Mothaff-----s woulda came at my head. “Oh yeah, that n---a Ice T...” Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And they’d be like, “Ice-T,” then they’d say, “No that’s Ice and... ooh, oh, that’s who them n----s... OK, cool, chill, I’m sorry. I take that back.” So, you know.

Jeff Mao

But, at the same time, it’s like you are documenting this and also providing a lesson, like you said, both sides of the game.

Ice-T

The game is... Rap was just a stepping stone man. I just wanted out. I wanted the big house. I wanted the fly shit. I wanted everything every other hustler wants. Rap was just a way out. It was like a low hanging fruit. Like, “Oh, I can get out of it by telling stories about the shit I did? Oh, come on, that’s a lick.” And then, when I’m doing that, I get a call to be in New Jack City. I’m scared shitless. I can’t act. I can’t act. I’m like are you kidding me? And the way it happened, I’m in a club and I’m hollering at some girls and Mario Van Peebles said he heard me in the bathroom talking shit.

I was in the bathroom talking shit. I’m like, “Yeah, the problem is man, n---a, if they could put me under a microscope and find one molecule in me that gave a f--k then n----s could angle me you know? But they can’t figure me out ‘cos I don’t give a f--k about these mothaf-----s.” So, he said, “Whoever said that’s gonna be my movie.” So then, he walks up to me. I’m talking to some females and shit, campaigning [laughter]. So he comes and says, “I want you to be in a movie.” I thought that was that Hollywood bullshit. You know, when you see somebody from Hollywood, you walk up to ‘em, “We should work.” That’s that bullshit. I’m like, “Yeah, yeah, you be in the movie. Here. This is who they are, blah blah blah blah.” So he said, “Call Warner Brothers tomorrow.” So I call Warner Brothers, they ask me to come there. And he was on the up and up. So I read the script, Scotty. I’m like, “Yo dog, this is like all the lines.” He goes, “Yeah.” And I’m like, “Yo this is a cop.” He’s like, “Yeah.” I’m like, “This n---a got dreads, I got a perm.” I was more upset about the hair than the cop [laughter]. So I call up the homies. I’m like, “Yo they want me to be in a movie man. You know what I’m saying? They want me to play the police. How you feel about that?” N----s like, “Word. Could I be in the movie?” So then, I’m like OK, so I’m gone call, you know, talking to my boys in the jail now, you know, I respect them. Like, “Yeah, you know, I know you in the bowels of the devil and whoop de whoop, and we reached you with that money but they want me to be in this movie. They want me to play the police. How you feel about that?” “Word. If I was out, could I be in the movie?” So, you know, the homies wasn’t giving me no guidance. Right? So, of course, I’m getting my hair done at Good Fred’s and the girls, I’m telling the girls they wanna, they was like, “Yeah n---a, you better be in that movie because this is an opportunity. And y’all up here complaining about the conditions in the hood. Now you got an open door. If you don’t take that Ice, you’s a real life sucka. And plus, we know, when you make it you gone keep it 100 and you gone tell...” Well, they didn’t say 100 back then, “but you gone keep it real and you gone tell mothaf-----s what’s going on down here, not like these other mothaf-----s. And if you don’t do the movie, don’t come the f--k back up in here.” So I did the movie. And the movie made 87 million dollar. I got paid 23 thousand dollars. Welcome to Hollywood. You know, but that was the door that led me to the next movie, which was Ricochet with Denzel Washington. That’s when I thought I was going to get paid, right? Joel Silvers, the producer, he’s one of the biggest producers in Hollywood, he does The Matrix, so I’m walking in there like I’m finna get paid, jack, it’s Denzel, this shit is on, son. It’s for real. I walk in there, I say, “Yeah man, I’m going to get paid on this movie.” He goes, “Uh, Ice-T, you’ve done one movie.” So I took it in the ass one more time. It was like... that’s a figure of speech [laughter]. But that movie I made double the money for less the work. The first movie I really got paid was Tank Girl [laughter].

Jeff Mao

Tank Girl. Yes.

Ice-T

I played a kangaroo [laughter]. Yeah. Because you trying to get checks and it ain’t working, so I’m making a movie with Keanu Reeves called Johnny Mnemonic. Keanu Reeves had just done the runaway bus jumped off the gauntlet, so he’s hot. I’m up to here, I’m getting paid. I get a call from my manager. He goes, “Yo, they want you to play a stripper in Arizona.” I’m like, “Word? Hell f-----g yeah, I’m with that.” So that night I did like 1,000 sit-ups [laughter]. Because I always been kind of in shape, you know what I’m saying? So I was like, “OK, I got to get my LL Cool J buffness on now. Watch this.” So I’m in there trying to get swole real quick. And the next day they send me a picture of a kangaroo. And they say the movie’s called Tank Girl. I’m like, “Kangaroos? Look at this. What kind of stripper am I? What, I got a pouch? What the f--k has happened?” [laughter] I’m sitting there, and so I’m like, Lori Petty, this and that. And they told me Stan Winston was doing it, and I was like, “OK, I don’t know, am I going backwards?” When they told me how much money they was paying me, I was like [hops around the stage like a kangaroo / applause] You know what I’m saying? I got a check for that, you know what I’m saying? It’s like a million dollars. You n----s would hop for a million dollars too. I was like... And people were like, “You selling out.” Let me tell you, selling out is when you do something that goes against your integrity. I wasn’t selling slaves, the f--k you talking about? I have nothing against kangaroos. Nothing whatsoever [laughter]. You know? Nothing. So I was like y’all, I can do the movie and it’ll pay for some things. It allowed me to build a recording studio.

I follow Orson Welles, and Orson Welles said he didn’t like to act, he acted in order to be able to direct. So I learned from that that sometimes you got to do what you got to do to be able to do what you want to do. To fund what you... So I was like, I could take that money, I could build my recording studio, and then I don’t got to spend money on budgets. This is a move right here. You got to know how to make those moves. That led me to more and more movies.

Jeff Mao

And doing your own thing with the music. Continuing to do your thing with the music.

Speaker: Ice-T

Doing my music, but now from my crib. I had a house now in the hills, I got a studio called the Crack House that everybody in LA recorded in. I got a situation. Now I’m moving forward.

Jeff Mao

Was that like around the O.G. album cover? Is that what that was? Or was that a different?

Speaker: Ice-T

The O.G. album cover, this was after O.G.. This is when we started _ The Seventh Deadly Sin_ and some of the other records, we recorded 100% in my house.

Jeff Mao

Nice. When did O.G. as a term, when was the first time you heard that?

Ice-T

I heard it, that’s a gang term. O.G. just means the originals of a particular set, like not the second generation, the people who invented the set. Since I’m an older cat, I was around when a lot of these sets were born. They had Hoover Crips, 7459 Hoover Crips. I don’t even know if there was a ’60s back then. There wasn’t a ’40s. The different gangs just happened. You didn’t have a Front Hood, you just had the regular ‘60s and they had the [inaudible] gangsters. But some of these gangs came out of nowhere, like they would just be born. So the people who start those sets would be the O.G.s, original Gangsters. Then in LA we also use it for just original, the O.G. 501’s, jeans, those O.G. Chuck Taylors. Anything that was the original… O.G. white K-Swiss. That first shit, that’s that O.G. shit. OK? What happened was I knew the term, and I come out, I had three albums out. I had Ice… I had Rhyme Pays, Iceberg, and Power. When N.W.A dropped, up to that point the term gangsta rap hadn’t been coined. When Cube came out, and in the first verse of Straight Outta Compton, he says, “From a gang called n----s with attitude,” see? He didn’t refer to N.W.A as a band, a rap group. He referred to them as a gang. The press called it gangsta rap. So I said, “OK, if this is gangsta rap, I’m the original gangsta.” And that’s where the O.G. album came from.

Jeff Mao

I’d like to show a clip actually. There’s a ton of great performances from your career online, but I would like to show one.

Ice-T

Please don’t show no old shit of me looking goofy [laughter]. This is such a distinguished interview at this point. Don’t play no stunt real in this.

Jeff Mao

No, this on point.

Speaker: Ice-T

I’m nervous now.

Jeff Mao

Can we show the “O.G.” performance?

[video: Ice-T - "O.G." live at San Quentin (from Paul Rodriguez: Behind Bars, Fox Special, 1991) / applause]

Yeah. You got to tell us about that, because that’s a pretty amazing thing.

Ice-T

Well, you know what it was, they called me, they said, “You know, Paul Rodriguez is going to do a show, Behind The Walls of San Quentin. Would you go in there and perform?” And I’m like, “Yeah.” It was a lot of security, a lot of shit. But you know what I’m saying? It’s like if you’re going to go up in there with some unauthentic shit, them motherf-----s ain’t really with that. You can’t go up in there and promote gangsterism and shit. They respected me in there enough to perform. You take somebody, I’m not going to make no names because that helps people become famous, because I’ll do this whole two hour interview and then the first time I say a name that’s all they’ll show. But rappers that promote like they big drug dealers and all that old bullshit, and then they go in there, they not going to perform that in front of those inmates. Them n----s’ll be like, “Shut the f--k up, bitch-ass n---a. You ain’t done none of that shit.” You got to be pretty official.

But if you listen, “Original Gangster” is an interesting song. Because “Original Gangster” explains what we just talked about. It explains the transition of me trying to rap like rappers, and then having my friends tell me… The words, “Ten years ago I used to listen to rap is flow, talk about the way they rocked the mic at the disco, I liked how that shit was going down, I dreamt about ripping the mic with my own sound, so I tried writing rhymes something like them, my boy said, “That ain’t you, Ice, that just sound like him,” so I sat back, thought up a new track, I didn’t fantasize, I kicked the pure facts, motherf-----s got scared because they was unprepared, who would tell it how it really was? Who dared? A young n---a from the West Coast, LA, south central fool where the Crips and the Bloods play, when I wrote about parties, it didn’t fit, 6 in the mornin’, that was the real shit.” Then the next verse says, “When I wrote about parties, someone always died, When I tried to write happy, yo, I knew I lie, because I live a life of crime, why play it blind? A simple look at anyone with two cents would know I’m a hardcore player from the streets, rapping about hardcore topics over hardcore drumbeats, a little different than the average, though, jet you through the fast lane, drop you on death row, because anybody who’s been there knows that life ain’t so lovely on the blood-soaked fast track, that invincible shit don’t work, I’ll throw you in the joint, you’ll be coming out feet first, so I blast the mic with my style, sometimes I’m ill and other times buck wild, but the science is always there, I be a true sucker if I act like I didn’t care, I rap for brothers just like myself, dazed by the game in a quest for extreme wealth, but I kick it to you hard and real, one wrong move and your cap’s peeled, I ain’t no superhero, I ain’t no Marvel comic, but when it comes to game I’m atomic, It drop in the straight point blank and untwisted, no imagination needed cause I lived it, this ain’t no f-----g joke, this shit is real to me, I’m Ice-T, OG.” [applause] When you take the rhyme apart, it’s literature. It’s explaining something. It’s linear. It’s like Chuck says, “I don’t rhyme for the sake of riddlin.”

Jeff Mao

I mean, when this work along with N.W.A became…

Ice-T

Can I have some of this Red Bull cause I need some shit [picks up can].

Jeff Mao

Oh absolutely.

Ice-T

This shit will have me talking way faster too [laughter]. Here’s something I posted on the internet. People said I was a motherf-----g liar. I don’t drink. I don’t smoke.

Jeff Mao

Right.

Ice-T

I never smoked weed. I have no tattoos and I don’t get high. People like, “That’s bullshit.” I’m like, “No that’s the truth, ask the homies they here.” I was the designated sober n---a before they had a name for the designated driver.

Jeff Mao

Right.

Ice-T

When I was young cats was like, “Yo Ice, hit the weed.” I’m like, “I don’t want to hit the weed.” “Well, you a bitch if you don’t hit the weed.” “Well, if I’m a bitch, make me hit it.” “Why you trippin?” [laughter] Then sooner or later people respected that. Now, everybody knows… I socially drink. If you put a cran and vodka in front of me I might sip on it a little. I’m not afraid of liquor.

Jeff Mao

Right.

Ice-T

I never smoked weed. I never got high. Well, I have done Ecstasy because they told me it was a sexual drug. I had to test that shit out. That shit is good shit. That shit had choir music coming out the pussy [laughter]. Had a glow around it. I understand this drug. But, I’m pretty much straight edge, pretty straight edge. Y’all do E too. You done it. You know what happens. The bad thing about that, it’ll give you the best sex or the worst argument depending on what the f--k happens. Did we lose topic?

Jeff Mao

No, we’re right on.

Ice-T

This is a conversation with Ice-T.

Jeff Mao

It’s flowing.

Ice-T

Get to know me.

Jeff Mao

I mean when gangsta rap became this phenomenon, you have all of these spin offs. Everybody doing it. This is what you paved the way for. I’m sure there was a point of pride like, “I made this happen. I was the foundation of this,” but then it has to also be over saturation.

Speaker: Ice-T

Well, no, it was a lot of people. OK so you got me. In the Bay, you had Too Short. Too Short was doing “Freaky Tales.”

Jeff Mao

Right.

Speaker: Ice-T

I met Too Short and Too Short was just talking about f-----g girls. He had this real basic line, “I met this girl her name was Sally.” I’m like, “This little n---a’s crazy, right.” I met him... He had these drug dealers that were sponsoring him, called 69 Girls. I think drug dealer slash pimps. These some players. They said, “We gonna meet you and Too Short up Early’s.” They brought him, and me and him became friends. See, this was a game like let’s not create beef. If he knew I’m poppin in LA and he’s in... Let’s just, let ’em meet and they can become friends. Me and Short have been friends since the very beginning.

Then down in Houston, Geto Boys popped off. OK. They was on some more real ridiculous gangsta shit. In New York there was a group called Mobstyle.

Jeff Mao

Mobstyle, yeah.

Ice-T

Which was Alpo and them, Pretty Tony. They was active gangstas in Harlem. I was aware who was doing it but prior to me, I was the first person to step across the line. Now, I was inspired by Schoolly D. Schoolly D made a record called “P.S.K,” which was about the Park Side Killas. I was at a club, first time I heard “P.S.K,” and I was like, “This is the dopest shit.” I hope they play “P.S.K” tonight at the party… But it comes on like [makes noise], it sounds like angel dust. I don’t do dust but I feel that’s what it sounds like. [makes noise] Schoolly was like, “PSK we making that green, people always say, what the hell…” I’m like, “Who’s this pimp ass n---a…” Everyone was yelling on the mic. I’m like, “This is the flyest shit.” I searched the record down and he said, he’s singing about Park Side Killas but it wasn’t graphic. The only thing he says in the record is, “One by one I’m knocking you out.” Then he says, “I put my pistol up against his head, said sucka-ass n---a I should shoot you dead.” I’m like, “This is some fly shit.”

I took the cadence from that and made “6 In the Mornin’.” If you listen to, “P.S.K we making that green.” “6 in the morning police at my door.” The same cadence. I took the music from “Mythological” to do “Colors.” There’s a guy named King Sun who had a record called “Mythological.” “Mythological, Mytho, Mythological.” All musicians are influenced by other music. It’s only biting if you can absolutely tell. I’ll tell you I’m influenced by this song. You’re like, I never knew that because that’s how musicians work. But “Mythological,” King Sun says, “When I get ill it’s a reason because it’s duck season, hunter of the fronter.” When I did “Colors” I said, “I am a nightmare walking, psychopath talking.” I’m taking his energy and vibe but rockin with my own words. It’s how these shits started to happen.

Now, Cube was a little homie. Cube was going to Arizona University. He used to come to the shows and shit. When they were Wreckin’ Cru then he was in C.I.A. Then they became N.W.A. Out comes the “Boyz N the Hood.”

Jeff Mao

Right.

Ice-T

Which he called, “6 In the Mornin’ part two.”

Jeff Mao

Right.

Ice-T

Because, “6 in the mornin’ police at my door,” “The Boyz N the Hood are always hard.” These all records kinda inspire the next one.

Jeff Mao

How much did Rakim influence you because when I listen back to some of this Power era Iceberg, I feel I hear some of Rakim’s influence on you as well.

Ice-T

Well, Rakim made everybody want to learn how to flow cause everyone was rapping a certain way like Run DMC. Then Rakim started rhyming and you were like, “This shit is just the most smooth style.” “Take you on a walk through hell, freeze your dome and watch your eyeballs swell, guide you out of triple stage darkness.” I’m like, “This n---a right here is the best rapper in the history of the world.” But see, certain rappers I try to get my flow more smoother and better. When I heard Das EFX, I thought I was going to have to quit. I can’t rap like that. I heard certain people and you’re like, “Yo.” When I heard Twista, I’m like, “I’m out. I can’t out rap these n----s.” But then I would write rhymes like, “I hear your style although you rhyme quicker, no matter what you do I’ll always lace mine thicker, jealousy will make a fool die quicker than liquor, watch your back with your n----s cause it’s right where they’ll stick you.”

My thing was to not just outrap you but have thicker heavier content. ‘Cos I used to see people winning battles. I’d seen cats go out and do 36 bars and then seen somebody eat them with eight bars. I knew that it was content, content, content. Rakim, of course Melly Mel was an inspiration. Big Daddy Kane, everybody, KRS One. Cube to me was the best LA rapper, his energy, his excitement, his youth. The first verses of “Straight Outta Compton,” to me, that was the hardest rap record ever made. When them n----s came on like that I was like, “Hold the f--k up.” I never felt in competition with N.W.A cause it was three or four of them. I was a soloist. We were friends. We used to tour together, D.O.C, Cube. The thing about LA hip-hop, LA is a very small tree. It’s Ice-T, which I created The Syndicate, which is a group of groups with a common goal. Delicious Vinyl, and N.W.A and who they became. You could call Dre, you could call Cube. You could call me. I was connected to Cypress Hill through Mugs. And you could squash beef. The only beef that ever happened on the West Coast was N.W.A and that was a family feud. And we all had to step out of it. Except when Cube was fighting with Cypress Hill, we kinda stayed out of that too. There’s never been no real west coast beefs.

Jeff Mao

I mean you mentioned content obviously, layers of content, and as controversy followed you, well I remember you on Oprah back in the day and it’s like...

Ice-T

That’s when Oprah was like Donahue.

Jeff Mao

Right. And with Tipper Gore, Nelson George and Jello Biafra and I think it was frustrating even for me as a viewer for your lyrics to be taken out of context and isolated and examined in a way that was not really showing the full scope of what you were doing. And I just wanted to know, how frustrating it was... If it was frustrating for me, just watching it, I can only imagine how being under the microscope and being targeted this way constantly... Because you were a spokesperson.

Ice-T

Well you see, the thing of it is, you can’t get in, you can’t worry about that. Like, if I don’t, if I know you’re not basically on the same level of intelligence of a topic that we’re talking about, I can’t debate you. So if I, if you’re like a real music journalist, and you really understand the business, me and you can have a deep discussion. But when somebody from left field, that’s like somebody that doesn’t know football attacking football. Like you don’t even know what the f--k you’re talking about.

So when people would attack the music, first, you don’t even listen to rap. You don’t even understand the first thing about it, so that shit just rolls off of me. Only time I might ever feel attacked, is if I’m attacked by my peers. If somebody who I think should know better, like when The Source magazine came at me, but I went at them. I called ‘em, “F--k Source you know, ‘cause you can’t kiss kick me, you can’t put me in there as artist of the year and then on the back cover diss me like, you trying to play both... You either my friend or foe.” So, that offends me but, other than that, you know people that don’t understand shit, you know, that’s like me attacking atomic fusion or some shit. Like me getting at some people, “Oh well your accelerator is too big.” “No, just shut the f--k up Ice. You don’t even know what this shit is and you over here worrying about how big it is and f--k you.” You know?

Jeff Mao

Right.

Ice-T

So, it doesn’t really offend me as soon as I know you... You know, I saw this movie on Jim Morrison. And when he was in the Doors and you know this journalist was talking shit to him and he had the best answer, he says, “Maybe you don’t understand it.” And that’s the answer. You just don’t understand it.

Jeff Mao

I’d like to show another clip, this is from ‘92 I think ‘cos I know you’ve talked...

Ice-T

Oh lord.

Jeff Mao

I know you’ve talked about Body Count and “Cop Killer” forever, but I just feel like this is a sort of representation of the sort of things that you were dealing with at the time.

Speaker: Ice-T

Here we go, this, I didn’t know this was gonna be this type of situation.

Jeff Mao

This is from ‘92, Ice-T.

[video: Ice-T A Current Affair interview / applause]

Ice-T

That interview was from last week [laughter]. Same shit, same dumb ass topics. Same out of touch white lady. It’s like, you know, that was in Australia so I started the interview saying like, “Yo, you can’t really... If you haven’t dealt with these topics it’s impossible for you to really understand them and have compassion for them.” You understand?

It’s like right now, Harvey Weinstein is in trouble because he’s touching women he’s doing a lot of wrong things. Women feel that. As a man, as much as you side with the women, it didn’t happen to you so your feeling is there, but it’s not as real as it is for those women that have gone through that stuff, that deal with that type of bullshit day in and day out. So, a lot of times people have to understand that these issues are real but I’m not, I can’t really emphasize with them absolutely.

You know, when someone white says, “I understand the black struggle.” I’m like, “Impossible.” It’s impossible. You know, it has to happen to you. You have to go through it to really understand it. But I understand the allies and the people that want to come close but, you know like I say, the easiest way to make somebody mad about racism is tell them it doesn’t exist. And then you’ll get ‘em mad. But a lot of black people really haven’t dealt with adverse racism. They haven’t been to the south. There’s degrees of it. “Oh you know, one time I walked in a spot and the people followed me around.” You ain’t really, you ain’t been down in Mississippi or some of that shit. You know, I, fortunately I’ve been all over the world and I’ve learnt this, that humans don’t get along. Period.

I don’t give a f--k where you’re from. Humans, the human animal is a very combative animal. So, we’re in the United States, we have black on white situations because of that, the adversity that went here. If you go to Asia, you know Chinese, Japanese people, Korean people, they mad at each other. Then you go to London, they don’t hate black people, they hate Indian people. You know? Every place you go... I remember I was in Australia right? So I’m with the coolest white boy I ever met in my life he, “Oh Ice, I love you. Move next door to me, live with me.” You know? “Make love to my wife.” You know that kind of motherf----r. So I’m rolling, and I’m like, “I wanna go to the outback.” He goes, “No, we don’t wanna go there.” I said, “Why?” He said, “You might run into a bunk.” I said, “What’s a bunk?” He said, “That’s an Aboriginal. That’s the sound they make when you hit them with the truck.”

Jeff Mao

Oh, wow.

Ice-T

See. So a lot of racism is right under the surface, it’s just not racism towards you, but you got friends who are like, “I’m not racist.” But then they’ll say a racial slur to somebody Asian or somebody Indian or somebody Arab. You know, it’s an evil human trait.

Jeff Mao

Ah, one of my favorite quotes from your first book The Ice Opinion, is, and I know you’ve said this in songs as well, but, “F--k the first amendment, it was written by lunatics.”

Ice-T

Well the whole constitution was written by lunatics. I mean, the same day they signed it, if they read the constitution at all, it also says you can own people. Right? You know, black people are a portion of a man, a certain percent. It has a lot of crazy shit in there and they all read it, “Hmm, looks good to me.” And they signed that shit. So they were all lunatics if they believe you could own people, but then they made amendments, but that first document was full of wild shit. It was full of wild shit and now the fact that we’re still holding on to the constitution is crazy.

Jeff Mao

Well yeah. So, since the ’90s, you’ve been addressing mass incarceration, environmental issues, fear mongering as a method of controlling people. The religious...

Ice-T

Donald Trump.

Jeff Mao

The religious right’s efforts to suppress...

Ice-T

Donald Trump. Pretty much everything Trump does.

Jeff Mao

Very familiar sounding. How do you gage what kind of progress, if any, has been made?

Ice-T

I don’t know man. I think a lot of progress has been made. I think people are getting smarter. People also delusional too. I... You know, I study a lot of the philosophers. And most of them go insane because you think too much. I just don’t think you ever going be at peace. I think that this is just the way that this earth is gonna be.

We live in these bubbles of like-minded individuals and we move from bubble to bubble. I’ll give you an example, we like hip-hop. We’re all here, this is a hip-hop bubble, but say for instance you play chess. I don’t play chess. So you’ll leave this bubble and you’ll go to your bubble of chess playing friends, OK? Some of these people wanna go smoke weed so they’ll go in their weed bubble. And you keep transferring from like-minded friends to other like-minded friends and this is how you move around. But none of us all stay in the same bubble all the time. So humans are searching for peace. The problem is, everyone’s peace infringes on other people’s peace.

Like, me and you are neighbors. I like playing my music loud at two in the morning. You want to sleep. You want peace, I want peace, it’s never gonna work. To a serial killer, killing is happiness to this motherf----r right? But he’s looking for happiness. So everyone in their search of happiness will infringe on everybody. You’re like, “Oh we need clean energy.” “F--k that. I want my Ferrari, I want my gas and you can eat a dick. I don’t give a f--k.” Then you’re trying to get people to care about something that’s gonna occur after they die. Humans? Selfish humans? To really care about something that’s gonna happen in 100 years. Mothaf-----s don’t care what’s gonna happen tomorrow. So, we’re in a world of these animals with free... We can do anything, we have this ability to make choices. The cool thing about humans is a human will do the worst possible shit and then wonder why they did it. We will all do it. You will, you’ll f--k over your best friend. You’ll cheat on your spouse. You’ll do some shit and say, “What the f--k?” ‘Cos humans are f-----g... We can’t control ourselves.

So, the theory that there’s gonna be some kind of blanket, euphoric scenario where everybody’s gonna get along, forget about that shit. It’s not gonna happen ever. This earth is made up of a whole bunch of little gangs, and a whole bunch of little cliques. And also we teach gang culture to our kids not knowing it. Your street is better than the street next to it. Your school is better than the other school. Your team is better. Your religion is better. That’s gang banging. We’re better. We’re... Ooh, the skinny girls are better than the fat girls. Everybody is picking a team and a side, and then we bang on each other. Go to Houston, the Dodgers in Houston, mothaf-----s will kill each other. Them mothaf-----s is dead serious about it. It’s a game, but some people say “No, we’re really better.” And that’s the problem. So what I do, keep my black ass in the house playing X Box. I keep my black ass. I got my wife. I got my little kid. I keep my friends that I like and they can only stay in my house, when they’re in my bubble, when they’re doing the shit I like. When they wanna do some shit they like, they gotta leave my bubble and take they ass some f-----g where else. Doesn’t mean they can’t get back in my bubble, but they can’t get back in one bubble with that bullshit. And that’s how I roll. Wanna hear a joke? Sometimes, when I’m home, I sit on my... I sit on the floor. I pull my knees in real close to my chest. I put my hands around my legs like this, and I lean forward real slow. That’s how I roll. [laughter] I got jokes! I mean, people don’t know now man, I’m a funny dude. People interviews... They come over my house, they expect to see mothaf-----s on meat hooks and shit, and stripper poles and shit. I’m like, “Nah, nah, I’m pretty civilized.”

Jeff Mao

All right. Let’s play one more civilized song.

[music: Ice-T – “99 Problems” / applause]

Ice-T

Well, what’s your question. You know that was the first version of it.

Jeff Mao

Yeah.

Ice-T

Uh, I was sitting with Brother Marquis from 2 Live Crew. And he was telling me how he missed “Woop There it Is.” Now, “Woop There it Is” was a big hit record back in the day. “Woop! There it is.” And what that was was a song that... And the DJs from Magic City made that record.

Jeff Mao

OK.

Ice-T

And, when the girls would strip, and when they would bend over and you could see it, they go, “Woop! There it is!” That’s where it came from. And Marquis was like, “N---a they saying that shit right in my face.” That was the phrase that pays. Right? And right after that he says, “Man I got 99 problems and a bitch ain’t one.” I’m like, “What the f--k did you just say?” And he said it again. And I said that’s a song. So, you know, in my mind I went. I got DJ Ace and I went to make a record, and the song was all about different types of girls. “I got a hoe from the east, I got a hoe from the west, I got a hoe that likes the jacket off, and rub it in her chest, I got a bitch in the north, a bitch from the south, a bitch that loves to suck it long and hold it in her mouth, a bitch with hair, bitch with none, bitch with a knife, bitch with a gun...” So, I’m naming off all these different bitches. But at the end I go, “And I love ‘em all, I love ‘em crazily and they love me back, that’s why they stay with me, so if you having girl problems, I feel bad for ya son, I got 99 problems and a bitch ain’t one. Hit me!” Now, that’s the song. That was on the Home Invasion album. It’s like my fifth album, I think. So Chris Rock is my friend. Chris Rock and me became brothas from New Jack City. So, Rick Rubin was with Chris Rock and he was like, “Yo man I’m about to work with Jay Z, I need some ideas,” and Chris Rock said, “You gotta do this record.” So they took it to Jay Z. Jay Z listened to it and he put his spin on it. And you know, I got paid. They paid publishing for it, you know. And the record came out. The cold thing that got me with Jay... He didn’t only take the “99 problems and the girl ain’t one.” He took the “hit me.” The hit me got me more than the rest of it! ‘Cos he goes, “If you having girl problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 problems and the bitch ain’t one. Hit me!” The n---a took my hit me. That... The hit me. Like this n---a went in like, “I’m taking that too n---a.” [laughter] But, you know, it was music. Now people like, well why Jay Z didn’t give you a shout out? You know. He could have said that?

Jeff Mao

He gave you the publishing rights?

Ice-T

That ain’t really Jay Z’s get down. Jay Z just does his thing. I woulda liked if he had said, yo coulda said my name in it, like DJ Khaled at the end, “Ice!” You know? Do something. You know, I mean Jay Z super, super duper. You know? I remember I met Jay Z. Big Daddy Kane brought Jay Z over my house back in the day and Jay came over. He was wearing a little backpack and shit like he was... He was rapping with this guy named Jazz. He had a record out called “Hawaiian Sophie.” He was a little young kid. And he was just sucking the game up. And we would talk, and Jay was listening to every... See, like we got f----d for our publishing. Jay Z didn’t. He was a student to where every G that he would be around, he would take their game and apply it. So, you gotta take ya hats off to Jay Z ‘cos Jay Z was just that smart. I remember we put him in a Bentley, him and Dame got in my Bentley. And they was like, “Why this Rolls got a B on it?” I’m like, “You n----s is from the hood, for real. You know. This is a Bentley.” But they was my n----s you know. And at first we took Jay Z off to Sway and Tek and that was the first time I seen somebody just rap like that without writing. He was just... Made a rhyme up in his head. He sat there for a minute and stuff. But he’s like a prodigy. He’s a special person. He has that ability. Everybody can’t do that. So respect to Jigga.

Jeff Mao

And you actually reclaimed the song by redoing it.

Ice-T

We did it Body Count.

Jeff Mao

With Body Count, right.

Ice-T

Yeah. We did it on the blood... No, no, on the Manslaughter album. We remade the record just for the hell of it. The record label wanted to do it. They like yo, we wanna bring it back, you know. I’m not somebody right now that’s in search of any kind of credit. I mean, I’ve had a very extreme life, a very extreme career. I’ve gotten my share of everything. People say, “Well you don’t get enough respect.” I’m like if I got more respect, mothaf-----s would carry me around. Like, you know what I’m saying? I’m good. I’m good. You know? I don’t feel anybody owes me shit. When Dre got a billion dollars, people called me up, “Did Dre give you some money?” I’m like, “What the f--k Dre supposed to give me some money for?” Dre paid me the $20 dollars he owed me. You know what I’m saying? People think that that’s how this game goes, but no, it’s like you eat what you kill. You know what I’m saying? You know, you gotta go out here and bust your ass. That’s why I got so many different jobs, because I like fly shit. I want fly shit. And it just don’t come from sitting on your ass. So, when I figured out I could do a little acting, do a little rapping, create another band, write a couple books, produce some TV show, do all the…

Jeff Mao

Directing.

Ice-T

Directing. I’m just trying to do everything. You’re only here for a short period of time man. You know, you gon’ sleep whether you want to or not. You gon’ pass out, and between that bust yo ass. You know what I’m saying? Sleeping is not a choice. You will go unconscious. So, when that happens, go unconscious. Then, when you get yo ass up, get back to work. You dig what I’m saying. But just sitting around. You know, I used to go to work. I would get up at 5:00 in the morning, I’m on the set busting my ass. Man, I had n----s calling me at 1:00 in the afternoon, “Yo, yo, I f----d up.” Yeah, you f----d up, n---a, you woke up at 1:00 in the afternoon, n---a. What is really good? You was out all night and all that,” and, ya know, it requires a grind. This week grind, I came out here, I came out here Saturday, rehearsed, did the Loud Wire Music Awards Tuesday. Got on a plane Wednesday. Flew back to New York, did Law & Order Thursday, Friday. Got back on the plane this morning. Got here an hour ago. I’m sitting here. Imma do Uncle Jamm’s Army. Get on a flight back to New York because I gotta be back on the set Monday at 5:00. So, you know, you gotta be willing to put in that level of work. It’s not, it’s not, it’s not, it just doesn’t drop outta the motherf----g sky.

Jeff Mao

Well, I mean, ya know,the thing…

Ice-T

I like this couch. See I’m so glad that you had some luxury so we could luxuriate during this shit, but I mean I’m lacking, I mean I thought a cold glass of water or some shit should be within arms reach or something for a player. But, you got Red Bull. And, this is a Red Bull event. So, we gonna blow this up. And, Redville, Red Bull, you need to be cutting me a motherf----g check ‘cos [holds up can] I, I, I believe I have wings [laughter]. And, you know, I got a daughter now. I got a one-year old daughter so I ain’t turning down no kinda work, no kinda work. You, you know, I mean I got to hustle the rest of the way out, man. I gotta a little daughter. Her mama she got, they got... That little girl got expensive taste already, you know what I’m saying, so, I gotta hustle.

Jeff Mao

Yeah, no doubt. I think we’re gonna open it up for questions if anybody has some…

Ice-T

Let’s do some questions, ‘cos I done rambled enough. And, the thing of it is, I can answer questions about so many different things. Whether it’s music, whether it’s film, television, streets. I know a lot of shit.

And I’ll tell you the truth, I think my brand is honesty. I think, you know, people go, “Ice, even if Ice is doing a lemonade commercial, that motherf----r does not give a f--k and he’s just being Ice,” ya know. So, once you find out that that’s what your brand is, it’s a blessing ‘cos you just do you and you don’t have to fake the funk.

So, let’s answer some ques... Who? Who? They’re dark out there. It’s like the Spanish Inquisition.

Jeff Mao

Do we have a question for Ice?

Ice-T

Just yell it.

Audience Member

My name is Kevin Clark, from Okayplayer.com. I just wanted to ask you, if you had to define your style using your favorite video game, what would it be?

Ice-T

Define my style?

Audience Member

Yeah, your rap style or…

Ice-T

Resident Evil.

Audience Member

Can you elaborate, like, why?

Ice-T

It’s just that, you know, I just wander through the hip-hop game, you know, looking to find the right room where I’m supposed to be and motherf-----s is jumping out at me and I got a shotgun.

Audience Member

Alright, thanks, bro.

Ice-T

What kinda question was that? [laughter]

Audience Member

I know you love video games.

Ice-T

You, but ya know, yeah, yeah, but I, yeah, that was my favorite game. It’s my favorite game. Question.

Jeff Mao

Alright, whose next?

Audience Member

I got a question.

Audience Member

Is there another mic?

Ice-T

Two. That’s good.

Jeff Mao

There are two mics and we’ll alternate.

Ice-T

Go. Yes, sir. Yes, sir

Audience Member

Alright, respect guys. Been a fan since Colors came out when I was in elementary school. Gotta question. The Art of Rap documentary was incredible, an incredible contribution to hip-hop culture. I wanted to know if you had any other documentaries planned for the future and, if so, what would be the topic?

Ice-T

Now Art of Rap was done... I was sitting at home, I was just watching TV and I, I mean, I just felt hip-hop was going on a severe turn downward. You know, it was lack of skills and it just... I said, you know what? A documentary is supposed to document things. So, lemme see can I grab the hip-hop I remember, the people that were a part of my life, while they’re still alive. And, if you notice, at the end of the Art of Rap, how many people had passed, we had that scrolling of all the people that we’d lost in hip-hop. And, I’m like, you not gonna be able to get Dr. Dre, Afrika Bambaataa, you ain’t gonna be able to get all these people. So, I wanted to capture that. And, I just said, look, we’re not gonna talk about beef, cars, money. We gonna talk about the craft. And, I think we came off with a great project.

Now we have the Art of Rap tour, which has been touring for the past three years, where I try to pick people that represent the craft. My man, Hen Gee, is doing the Art of Rap Latino, trying to go down into Mexico and represent that. That’s not... I’m not gonna do another one. That’s for you to do. People say, “Well you didn’t reach the south,” or this… I only try, I only deal with my journey and at the end of that I had a 3 hour movie, which had to get cut to 90 minutes to get in Sundance. That meant I had to cut some of my friends out. That was one of the hardest things I ever had to do.

But, my future is, I wanna do film and direct. I got a movie that I’m, I wrote and I’m working on now called The Dark which is a kinda horror movie, kinda a little Dexter, a little Saw, a... Because with the success of Get Out, I think people are ready for that. So, it’s a revenge based movie. There’s an old movie called Dr. Phibes with Vincent Price. You know it’s gotta be Ice-T. It’s gotta be Resident Evil. It’s gotta be dark side. Like, Cube, he went and did a lot of comedies and stuff, and I take my hat off to that, but now I can’t do no motherf-----g comedy. So, I gotta, I gotta do a movie that when you see it, people go, “Yo! This shit, I don’t know if I like that shit, like, yo, Ice f----d with me bad,” like. I wanna f--k your head up. So, it’ll have a weird cult side to it.

I talked to Quentin Tarantino about helping me with the film and he said, “I can’t help you, Ice. First off, you’ve been making movies your whole career. What are all these albums? These are movies.” And, he says, “If I help you, people are gonna give me the credit.” He said, so you go do the movie when it’s time, ya know, it’ll be the shit. So, that’s my next thing, a feature film. It’ll be very bizarre, you’ll probably hate it.

Question.

Audience Member

Hi. Thank you so much for coming out. I wanted to know if you... With suicide that’s happening right now with the millennials, I wanted to know if you are involved in any non-profit organization of youth and music and the importance of it or would you like to be part of that?

Ice-T

I’m not against it. I mean, I noticed that, you know, kids are going through lots of suicide and things of that nature. I think with the Internet, a lot of that is fueling the fire, a lot of the bullying and things of that nature, but, you know we talking about music, I mean, I was listening to three different records the other day talking about I wanna die. You know, that’s kinda like suicide music, you know what I’m saying? I never said that... Even ‘Pac and Big were writing ready to die records and I’m like, that’s one topic you won’t ever hear me talk about. I’m not trying to jinx myself. I’m trying to live around this motherf----r.

But, I would be, you know I’m not against it. I have so many charities and people... Most my money has always gone toward gang prevention and intervention because that’s the closest thing to me. I think when you pick a charity, you have to pick something that you are really involved with. Like people that are into cancer, they usually have lost somebody to cancer. Or different things like that, AIDS. Well, most of my friends have died out in these streets. So, that’s really where my heart is, is with gang prevention and intervention. But, I’m willing to talk later. You could talk to my people.

Audience Member

Yes, I actually got a card here for an upcoming event for you. So, I’d like to give that to you.

Ice-T

That’s beautiful. Hold on to that and we’ll do that later, OK? Are you going to the Uncle Jamm’s party?

Audience Member

Damn right. Yes.

Ice-T

It was a trick question. That’s where you can hand me that, at the party.

Audience Member

OK, I will. Thank you.

Ice-T

OK.

Audience Member

I got a question going back to Club Radio.

Ice-T

Yes, sir.

Audience Member

Glove and I were talking on the way over here, and I wanna thank you, and my question is, I was always amazed at how you kept the violence outside the club. I just always remember you saying, it’s about the music, it’s about the music.

Ice-T

Well, it wasn’t that hard at Radio ‘cos the hood didn’t really know the Radio existed. The Radio was, like, in the cut at MacArthur and the only cats that really knew, it was word of mouth. Like I had to bring, I remember I brought Spike and all my homies over there and I’m like, “It’s a club by MacArthur Park, and they’re like, “Where?” I’m like, “It’s hip-hop.” They’re like, “Where?” I’m like, “There’s white bitches.” “We’re okay, let’s go. Where we going B. Pick me up.” And we got there and I just showed up and it was a place to practice my craft and Alex kinda made me the head of the stage. Do you know how Glove got his name? Do you? Not by me, by Alex. Glove was bringing the equipment in. And Alex said, “Yo I need a DJ” and Glove said, “I could DJ” and he goes, “You need a DJ name” and he had on gloves. He said, “You the Glove tonight.” True story, am I wrong, Glove? That’s how it happened. And then Glove was spinning every night and I just kinda became the rapper, and we just became friends.

I remember one night, Madonna was there and they were like, “There is this girl downstairs that says she can sing” and I’m like, “Who is she? Madonna. Never heard of her.” She had this one record called, “Physical Attraction,” she’s new. So we take her downstairs and she shows me the album cover, I’m like, “OK come on, you gonna go.” And what I would do is, I would introduce people at the Radio like they were the biggest shit. I’m like, “Just from a world tour, her helicopter just landed in the parking lot. It’s about to go down y’all, Madonna!” I would do this for anybody and then if you sucked I’m like, “I’m never gonna introduce you again.”

So Madonna came out, she start singing, “Sexual Attraction” and at that time, I had a girlfriend named Lisa. So I ended up becoming part of Madonna’s show. She’s dancing, next thing you know, she’s taking off my shirt and playing with me and shit, and I’m just going along with it and my girl was pissed. I’m like, “That was part of the show, I’m just part of the show.” But I was feeling it, that shit was fun. But Madonna went on, she was there with Jellybean Benitez that night. She went on and actually me and her ended up signed to the same label, Sire, so it was interesting.

I ran back into her once she was super mega wealthy, and stuff and I said, “Madonna,” she remembered Ice and... It was good shit back in the day, the Radio. But we never really had a violence factor at the Radio. Uncle Jamm’s army, on the other hand, got gangster. Once the Rolling ’60s found out that the Sports Arena was close, was just like catch the five and catch that bus, you could just ride right up to the... You could pull right up in front of the Sports Arena, it was on. And they would come deep. I remember it got pretty heavy. But nobody ever got killed at an Uncle Jamm’s army party so that’s one plus. You might get stomped the f--k out but no one ever got murdered.

Audience Member

Once.

Ice-T

No gunfire. Right? Nobody ever got shot so... Yes sir.

Audience Member

I said once.

Ice-T

Somebody got shot?

Audience Member

[inaudible]

Ice-T

Gid.

Audience Member

What’s up man?

Ice-T

What’s up, baby? Where did they get shot? I remember Rory got his ass…

Audience Member

At the shrine.

Ice-T

At the shrine. But not... It wasn’t indoors? It was outdoors. It wasn’t inside your shit. The one thing about throwing a party is, once you let the people out, a lot of people are outside that never came to the party. LA is an inherently dangerous place. Especially when you bring people from all over to one place. You got cats that never seen each other and are sworn enemies.

Jeff Mao

Real quick, do you recall much about Breakin’ and Enterin’? I know everyone talks about Breaking. But the documentary, Breakin’ and Enterin’ was before that...

Ice-T

It was a guy named Topper Carew, wanted to do a little thing on breakdancing and it was a documentary, a girl named Kelly Minter was involved with it. And they just kinda ran around... Egyptian Lover was in it, Glove was in it, and it was one of the early documentaries about the LA scene. The good thing about it, all of us are friends and it was easy to get. Just even like, getting me here, if Gid and these guys call me, I’m not gonna say no. If it wasn’t for them I wouldn’t had the... See the thing of it is, is like, Gid and them didn’t give me my first record deal, but they gave me the first chance to see hope, like, there is something else. Because Gid and them knew, when they was dealing with me, I was one foot in the grave and the other one on a banana peel, we was... I wasn’t gonna be a rapper, but they were the first people in the streets that was getting money legit. I was doing the numbers. Everybody else wasn’t doing the numbers, but I was in there looking and when they would do the Biltmore or something, I’m like, “These n----s got $200,000 up in this motherf----r,” so I was figuring it out and I knew I could never really be a part of them, but I was aware that, that was a hustle and it was inspiring. Question.

Audience Member

I’m a little short so I gotta take this out. First off, thank you so much for coming out here, it has been amazing to hear you talk. My name is Kelsey, I write for Earmilk and I’m also a host of a radio show and I love to ask all artists who come on my show the same question and I would love to ask you. When exactly did you first fall in love with hip-hop and I know that you have talked about Iceberg really influencing your style and everything, but when was it like a time when you were just like, “Yo, this is it. This is the shit. hip-hop is amazing” and not just as a career, but just the music itself?

Ice-T

I was in the army and when you are in the army, you are with people from all over the country, and the guys from New York had tapes. They had the tapes of Flash and they had tapes of the radio stations and I was like, “Yo that’s cool” and of course I think the record that broke everybody was “Rapper’s Delight” and when “Rapper’s Delight” came on, hip-hop is just some kind of amazingly fun sounding thing. Hearing people rap like that was amazing. Now I thought I could do it. The trick with hip-hop is, it’s a culture, but it’s tangible. It’s not like if you go to an opera and you can see an opera or watch somebody figure skate and you say, “I can never do it” but with hip-hop, with a little practice, you could do it. So with a rapper… Now, to be a rapper, you have no practice just say any motherf-----g thing [laughter]. Just f--k it. It don’t even gotta be on beat. Just... “Percocet. Molly. Percocet.” F--k it. But with a little practice, you could be a DJ, with a little practice you could be a breakdancer, so it wasn’t so far outta reach. But it was when I heard “Rapper’s Delight” because I had... Previous to that, I used to write gangbanger rhymes. And I would write rhymes at Crenshaw, before I even knew what hip-hop was.

Wanna hear a gangbanger rhyme? A pre-hip-hop rhyme? Here go one. This is when I used to live in this area with my man Franzell in Triangle Park and we was like a... We had convinced them n----s at Crenshaw that we had 100 people, but it was just three of us in a gang. But we had them scared. But it went like this... Now this is five years, ten years before anybody had ever heard of rap. It’s, “Fall into a party on a Saturday night, and I left the pad, down and out for a fight, had on a waistline leather, Levi’s cuffed, under the coat, I knew I was buff because I was driving that iron, getting ready for the set, and I was packing a punch a n---a never forget, the ring in my ear was hanging halfway to the floor and I was so tight, I walked sideways out the door, now the hooptie was lifted, front, side and rear, glass was all tinted, wasn’t none of it clear, it was Cragered down,” Crager’s. “It was Cragered down, with a cold ass pearl, deep as diamond tucking the goddamn world, I had quadraphonic headphones with a tone you could fix, under the seat, I had a ’30 at six, now on the way to the party, I was scraping and hopping because I knew by tonight, there was gonna be some popping, when I got to the set, I just lay it on the ground, the Buddhist came to check it out from Chinatown, and when I fell in the party there was women for days, I was looking crazy in some hellified ways, I just walked in the corner, listening as they talk, first James Brown record I jumped up and crip walked, now I was walking so hard, couldn’t no one compete, I was about to turn out the party with my goddamn feet, but then some n---a went and got out of line and his nose, my fist had no trouble to find, after driving the iron so hard all that day, I punched his grill in, in one hell of a way, but his partners fell out and so did mine, squabbling went on for quite a long time, then all of a sudden I heard some popping, I knew not to soon this fight would be stopping, I seen ’22s, ’38s and a ’45, I knew not too much would be left alive, n----s broke out in a goddamn rage, I even think I seen a sawed off gage, but cuz, I was sent from hell not heaven, I broke out with the chrome plated 357, and the name of the game is simply survival, at the end of the night ten was dead on arrival, and me and my partners, we was gone like the winds, police blamed it on the Crips or the Brims, but some n----s knew in the corner in the dark, them crazy n----s reside in Triangle Park, they go by the name of Bronet, Zel and Tray and they belonged to the association called the EPA,” we called ourselves the Eliminators Pimping Association [laughter]. That’s some shit, I would do that at Crenshaw and entertain people, so when I read “Rapper’s Delight” I’m like, “I could do it,” the problem is, that’s not syncopated to a beat. So it took a while for me to learn how to rhyme on beat. Some people still think I can’t do it, but that’s when I fell in love because it was something that came out that I thought I was already good at.

Audience Member

Thank you so much.

Ice-T

Thank you. OK.

Jeff Mao

We got one more?

Ice-T

Let’s do three more?

Jeff Mao

Three more?

Ice-T

Let’s do three more. I mean you know, make it beautiful. Always add, give them a little extra. OK, yes sir?

Audience Member

When I was growing up, I grew up on three people that mentored my life forever and they all came from the hip-hop world. One of the guys was named Steve Jano, he used to sell mixtapes with Sir Jinx and Dr. Gray at the [inaudible] swap meet. One of my greatest mentors, and I learned my work ethic from this gentleman. The second person I learned my work ethic from was Rodger Clayton. If it were not for this guy, I wouldn’t have the work ethic and the drive I have in my life today, and I thank his family for creating who I am today.

Ice-T

That’s real talk. Respect Rodger, rest in peace, my dude.

Audience Member

I grew up with Egyptian Lover and Arabian Prince and the first place where they DJd at was The Cave in Lennox, California. And the second thing is a question. How did the Soulja Boy beef start?

Ice-T

Wanna get there?

Audience Member

Huh?

Ice-T

You wanna do that?

Audience Member

Yeah.

Ice-T

Alright this is what happened. It was a mistake. I did a mixtape with some of my friends and you know, I was in the mix booth getting ready to rap and right before I go in, they poking the line, they like, “Motherf----s don’t wanna hear you, n---a. They wanna hear Hurricane Chris and Soulja Boy,” now you can’t tell a n---a like me that. So me thinking... I’m in a studio, I just went on an Ice-T rant. Nowadays, you can’t even rant because motherf----s got cameras and telephones and everything around you, like I could be in the studio and I’m talking to you, and I look over, and the homie got a camera, “What the f--k is that?” “N---a, this is hood TV n---a...” “Turn that shit off.” I might segue into a murder at any moment, you know what I’m saying? But that moment they were talking shit, so of course I was like, “Man f--k [inaudible],” they taped it and they put that at the beginning of their mixtape. It was never meant to get out, it was just me talking shit. It wasn’t personal. So by the time people heard it, it sounded like I just woke up out my bed and went in on dude. I don’t even know dude. So later it came out and he said some shit like that to me and my son was like, “You gotta reply, you gotta reply,” so I said some more shit but... That’s why I don’t say names. Because this shit turns into something that’s bigger than what we are out to do.

I have nothing against Soulja Boy, I have nothing against anybody really. I have an opinion. Just like if you ask Celine Dion about singers, I’m sure she has an opinion, but it’s not hate, it’s not, “I don’t want this cat to eat” or whatever. He’s a kid, whatever, it’s not that deep. But the Internet will turn it into something deep and try and make it into more, because that’s what they feed off, nowadays. So I had to learn my lesson.

Audience Member

I just have a quick thing to say...

Ice-T

You’re Soulja Boy’s father? You came to kill me?

Audience Member

No.

Ice-T

You came to kill me.

Audience Member

I’m just a student of the game. Will hip-hop go back to its roots?

Ice-T

No.

Audience Member

That’s where it deserves to go back to, the roots.

Ice-T

You could say that forever. One thing I learned from Quincy Jones is, it’s not going backwards, things will always go forward. You aint getting rid of smartphones, you aint getting rid of… Shit will continually go forward and if you don’t progress with it then you are gonna be a dinosaur. You don’t have to be a fan of it, but that is the future. Let me tell you about hip-hop. Hip-hop follows the drug. Whatever the drug is, that’s what hip-hop sounds like. I come from the crack era. That’s where Wu-Tang Clan comes from. DMX. That’s that [shouts] because coke has you amped. Like, “Yo! F--k that! Wow!” Right? Now n----s is on cough syrup. So it’s a sedative, they are the... They’re dancing like this, they just like, “Yo, yo, yo...” And they’re on prescription medicine. That’s heroin, so it’s kinda like a sedative. So if you come yelling at these new rappers, you like, “You f-----g up my high.” They just want a molly, Percocet, molly, Percocet. So until the drug changes, the music is gonna sound like that. So you gotta get to talk to the drug dealers.

Audience Member

Exactly. Thanks for your time.

Ice-T

We need crystal meth to be big and then music will get back amped [laughter]. I’m just making jokes, you dumb motherf-----s.

Audience Member

Thanks for the time, Ice.

Ice-T

But it’s true, the music does follow the drug, track the movement. OOKkay. Two more.

Jeff Mao

I think we got, yeah two more.

Audience Member

How you doing, sir?

Ice-T

Your the last one, sweetheart. Let her go, let’s end with the woman.

Audience Member

Ladies first.

Ice-T

Ladies first. See there’s a gentleman left in California.

Audience Member

I don’t think this... it’s not on. Or is it? OK. Hi, OK so I write conscious rap and this is kind of an interesting segue from what you just said, but right now a lot of people don’t listen to conscious rap until you’ve actually made a name for yourself and if the beat slaps, people are gonna listen to it, so it doesn’t really matter what you are saying. Did you ever experience, during your time at, with your music career, having to change the way your music sounded so that the community would vibe with it?

Ice-T

I come from a different era, where if the record wasn’t on the radio, kids wanted it. They went to record stores. I had a girl over my house and she was looking at the gold and platinum records and she says, “You sold a lot of records, when?” I said, “When people used to go to the record store.” She says, “What’s a record store?” 21-year-old girl. So you’re in a different era now. That being said, I never got played on the radio. I never got, KDAY, they never f----d with me. When Chuck says, “Too black, too strong” he meant for BET. BET never f----d with me, they never f----d with Cube, they never f----d with KRS One. So the lane you are taking, you know who is gonna embrace you? White people. And when the white people embrace you, like I said, the black people are like, “She’s heard. She’s ours.” They’ll come. Have you been to a reggae concert?

Audience Member

Yeah.

Ice-T

It’s all white people. It’s all white people, because white people are more interested in the black struggle than black people because black people are like, “I been through that shit, I know what you talking about, I don’t need you to tell me how f----d up it is.” But white people are like, “Wow, I’m learning.” Real talk. I believe, I predicted the future. If you wanna go... I’m just gonna say this, before this. If you wanna go see Ice-T predict the future, go to the Internet, put in, “Ice-T predicts iTunes,” and five years before iTunes came out I predicted the exact format that they’re working on right now. Everything from my house. Now my next prediction. If a 21-year-old Public Enemy came out, a young one, real young, not 30, kids. If a young like... J. Cole and them are kinda close but they are not as militant as KRS One. A real militant, young kid, and a Lauryn Hill. A rebirth of that young, powerful black woman, speaking about soul... Can you sing?

Audience Member

Oh...

Ice-T

Oh, shit. There you go. “Well that’s nice, go back A&R, move her and take her out of here,” you need to sing. Singing or you need to hookup with the right singer, somebody that’s hitting. But if your lyrics are that potent and that heavy...

Audience Member

Compton?

Ice-T

To that potent and that heavy.

Audience Member

Compton.

Ice-T

Compton?

Audience Member

I think [inaudible].

Ice-T

Oh shit, some Crips is in here. OK, but it could happen.

Audience Member

Does it matter whether I’m a female or a male?

Ice-T

It doesn’t matter. A woman is needed right now.

Audience Member

Thank you!

Ice-T

A woman is needed because you got the Nicki Minaj, you got the Cardi B, you’ve got the Remy Ma but Lauren’s gone and she was the biggest. The hottest. So that female with that powerful, the Queen Latifah, that shit. It could really hit, but you need the right music. You gotta have a song behind it because now everything’s melody based. It’s not the boom bap. That’s my opinion... Ya know run with it. But it could work right now cause it’s needed. But don’t expect radio to give you any play. Don’t look for help. Just keep grinding. Just keep grinding. And when it pops, it’ll pop.

But, the worst thing you can do is think somebody’s gonna help you. Anybody in here that wants to be successful, the thought somebody’s supposed to help you or care. Your dream is your dream and only your dream. No matter how much you sit in front of me and tell me about your dream, it’s not my dream. It’s your dream and no ones gonna push for it like you. You could sit me and I could say, “Yeah, I hear you. I feel you. I feel you.” Five minutes later I’m back into my shit. I’m into mine. I gotta deal with what’s mine. So whatever is yours, you gotta go for it. Nobody, not even your man is gonna want it as much as you and if you don’t have that drive it’s not gonna happen. It’s just not gonna happen.

OK, one last question.

Audience Member

Thank you.

Audience Member

Man, thank you so much. I needed to be around a shit talking motherf----r tonight boy, I tell you.

Ice-T

A real player, that’s what I’m talking about.

Audience Member

Hey listen, I’m a Vietnam veteran from that era. I heard you spoke upon yourself being in the military. What was that like for someone like you and how long did you stay in and what branch of service?

Ice-T

I was 25th infantry.

Audience Member

Oh fun.

Ice-T

I was at Scholfield barracks. I mean, I went into the military because I had a daughter.

Audience Member

OK.

Ice-T

And I had a daughter in high school and you know I was…

Audience Member

Compton.

Ice-T

Compton!

Audience Member

He’s in the dark.

Audience Member

[inaudible]

Ice-T

OK.

Audience Member

[inaudible] ask a question, when he’s through.

Audience Member

Hold on bro.

Audience Member

[inaudible]

Ice-T

OK. So you... Let’s get back to the question

Audience Member

You were 25th infantry.

Ice-T

Yes sir. Yes sir. I went into the army because I had a daughter. I was on the street. I wasn’t really gonna make any good decisions at that point so I went. It was a enlistment office right next to Magnificent Brothers on Crenshaw. And I walked up in there and said, “I wanna get in,” I went in for the enlistment bonuses.

Audience Member

OK. There ya go.

Ice-T

It was cool for me, I mean I wanted to do it. The only way you’re gonna make it through the military is if it’s something that you... Were you drafted?

Audience Member

I was drafted so I was one of those haters man, I didn’t want to be there.

Ice-T

Right. I wanted to do it. So I did like two years in, two years out. I was pretty healthy. I was pretty athletic. And I felt I could do it. Two years in, then I realized it wasn’t for me cause one of my sergeant’s told me, he said, “You’re here, because you can’t make it in civilian life.” And I was like, “Wow”. That’s what really... I said, “Nah, nah, nah this ain’t the only thing I can do.

Audience Member

There yeah go.

Ice-T

Next two years I got planned on getting out, and when I got out I came right home, got in trouble.

Audience Member

OK.

Ice-T

It was... A good experience for me because it taught me how to deal with hard things like going through, ya know training and things like that.

Audience Member

Ice-T

I think you need a reference point to f----d up, so you need to know what’s f----d up so you don’t bitch about everything.

Audience Member

There ya go!

Ice-T

Once you been to Vietnam there’s nothing really a motherf----r could really do to you to bother you.

Audience Member

My life is easy yeah. Everything is cool.

Ice-T

It’s either that or the penitentiary.

Audience Member

Well ya know, by not wanting to go they say, “Well listen, if you don’t go with us you going to the penitentiary for 45 months,” I said, “Wait a minute I only weigh 130 pounds,” at that time, ya know I was pretty light. So I didn’t want to go in there and be somebody’s bitch. So, give me the 24 months instead of the 45 in the penitentiary. I had to go to the war and it was two years of f----d up shit man.

Ice-T

Well see, even though I was in the military I never went downrange. I have to take my hat off to you for your service versus mine, which was just 4 years of training.

Audience Member

Right, right.

Ice-T

We gotta respect the different levels of it. But it was a great experience for me.

Audience Member

Absolutely.

Ice-T

I still kinda operate on a military basis.

Audience Member

Right, right.

Ice-T

Like everything has to be planned out, thought out, timed out. So I carry a lot of that with me.

Audience Member

That’s cool man because, it was the worst two years of my life but it made me a better person now and that’s the cool thing about it. I appreciate you bro.

Ice-T

Absolutely. OK. Let’s wrap it up. Compton?

Audience Member

Yo Ice. I got one quick question.

Ice-T

This is my boy Spike.

Jeff Mao

OK, so this is officially our last one. Keepin it lovely.

Ice-T

One of my homies. He just came back from the joint, this is one of my boys that was in the streets with me early in the game. He just did 26 years in prison, he’s home. Give him a round of applause [laughter]. We’re not applauding for the prison we’re applauding for him being home.

Audience Member

The question I was gonna ask you was something that was intricate. You’ve always been a real solid friend, and, a person that I always looked up to. Especially in the early years when we grew up. You’re a few years older than me, but, I never forget... And I talked to some scared straight programs when I was in prison. I used to always use you as a role model to the kids in a way where... Choices. In life, we make choices. Ya know I made a lot of choices and some of the choices landed me down the road that I went thorough.

But I never forget, when you and I were younger and in the hustle and bustle you had made your mind up and nobody knew. You’re talking about the pre-Radiotron days and stuff like that. The decision that always stuck in my heart and my head even when I was doing all those years, was I remember talking to you and you said, “Spike I’m not doing that no more,” and nobody knew except you, based on the dreams you had. Based on what your life choices were gonna be. But that is something that always stuck with me and I always would give that to the kids and I would say, “I had a friend,” without having to ya know, put your name out, “I had a friend that always made the choice, and now as an adult, and as a more mature adult through my experiences. He told me one day that, Spike I’m not doing this no more”

Ice-T

Breaking the law.

Audience Member

Breaking the law. Choices. My question to you is, that was embedded in you... How is it that at that time you was able to break away through those choices? That’s the thing in life that everybody has to decide. In life right and wrongs a thin line like a milli-line.

Ice-T

The choice came to me for two reasons. One, my dad. My dad taught me whatever you’re gonna do, you gotta be a professional. If you’re gonna be legit, you’re legit. You don’t deal with criminals, you don’t cross that line. If you’re a criminal, you don’t deal with legit people. You don’t straddle the line, you’re picking one or the other. If we’re criminals we’re in the underworld and we keep all our shit secret. We don’t talk. We don’t take pictures. You know you and I have years of our lives that are un-photographed because we played by the code... Once I decided to step on the other side of the line I told you I’m done.

Now one of the reasons it made me done was all of the players that I admired were going under. I’m looking at all these hot cats that I admired, I’m like, “They going under and they calling me from the joint like, Ice don’t come here man. This ain’t no place for no player man. They don’t know nothing about no Dom Perignon up in here. They don’t know nothing about no filet mignon, you ain’t cut for this Ice. You got to,” and then, once I started to try to rap, people saying, “Ice, you got action. You got action. You know, white people like you. You can cross, you can get outta this situation.” And once I knew I had that chance, I had to make that decision.

And at that point I’m like... ’Cos you know the kinda shit we would do. We would hit a lick, we’d have money and then we’d go broke. Well I’d hit my last lick and I said this is what I gotta live off at this point. We weren’t drug dealers, we were rappers and stuff. So we didn’t have a consistent hustle, it was like we would be sitting around right now between licks until a score came and then we’d have to go outta town whatever, make the move. I was done. I’m like, “I’m not doing that no more, I can’t leave with ya’ll. I’m gonna stay here,” and I went broke. You remember when I stopped rapping.

Audience Member

I remember that very well, when you had to....

Ice-T

And I went broke. And I was still hustling.

Audience Member

I remember that.

Ice-T

And sometime you would come through and ya know, throw a n---a a few dollars. Ya know, so it was like withdrawal and it was a hard moment when you broke, trying to pursue something else and you know you can snap your fingers and go get a hundred thousand to go do something. But I had made that decision man and I don’t know it’s just a moment. It’s just a moment in your life where you just say I gotta make another decision, I gotta change.

Audience Member

Well I wanna thank you for that and that also is intricate in my life now. You know they needed to know that you the real deal. Man, a lot of people will say stuff just for the window dressing but from me to you, you the realest deal I’ve ever known in my life. Thank you.

Jeff Mao

I wanna thank everybody for coming out tonight and won’t you join me please, in thanking once again, Ice-T.

Ice-T

Thank you everybody. See you at the party.

[applause]