Martyn

Benji B

Please join me in saying a very warm welcome to Martyn. [applause] Anyone who chooses that record first is a friend of mine. How are you feeling?

Martyn

I feel good now, yeah.

Benji B

I’ve got a bit of a caffeine twitch after that one. So yeah, Martyn is in London playing a classic London tune. Red Bull Music Academy in London 2010, it’s good to have you in the city. I know London is a city that means a lot to you, isn’t it?

Martyn

Well, I’ve been here lots of times and got to know a lot of people here, a lot of clubs and a lot of music. It’s a city I always like to come back to, but one I like to leave as well, I must say. But yeah, it’s a good place.

Benji B

How has the city influenced your music?

Martyn

I guess it influenced me a in a huge way, way, way back in the day, we’re talking the early ‘90s now. I went on a pilgrimage to London because I discovered drum & bass through a friend of mine, I was intrigued by the music and thought, “I want to know more about this and it all comes from London, so I should go to London and see what this is all about.” So that’s what I did. After that followed loads more visits, loads more raving and buying records and all that good stuff.

Benji B

And what kind of clubs did this pilgrimage take you to?

Martyn

The Blue Note was the main one.

Benji B

The Blue Note used to be on Hoxton Square, near where everyone’s playing tonight.

Martyn

Is it?

Benji B

I think the gig’s at Queen of Hoxton tonight.

Martyn

Is that on Hoxton Square?

Benji B

No, but it’s not far from there. So tell me about Blue Note and why you’re not the only person to consistently reference that club as an inspiration.

Martyn

The Blue Note was quite small, I guess, two floors. The main floor was sort of a bar where they served food, they had a DJ there and usually they opened up just the top floor, I think it was – playing soulful R&B, funk, that sort of thing. And people just got in the mood. Then they opened the basement area. They had a huge soundsystem in there, I think by Eskimo Noise, who used to run the soundsystem. That was the main drum ‘n’ bass night in London, I guess, and it was run by Metalheadz, so you’d go in and see all these legendary Metalheadz DJs play. I don’t think they ever announced the line-ups, so you went in and saw who showed up.

Benji B

And where were you visiting from?

Martyn

From Holland. We had some friends here in Peckham, which is where we stayed, and we’d go out raving. Every Sunday.

Benji B

So you’d basically go out four nights in a row and then go record shopping.

Martyn

Something like that, and then come back and be all inspired. I guess, that’s how it kicked off for me ‘cause those Blue Note nights were very inspiring. Then I went back to Holland and said, “I want to do a night like this, create a similar sort of vibe.” So that’s what we did. It was a night called Red Zone, nothing to do with the Blue Note reference, but it was called Red Zone and we started inviting all these Metalheadz people as well. We started to build something in Eindhoven, and that’s how I started DJing because I was originally just a promoter, putting on nights and having fun at the events. It was me and my friend, and my friend DJed, but at the beginning it became a bit much for him to DJ the whole night. So he said, “Instead of me doing six hours why don’t you do three and I’ll do three?” And that’s how I started DJing, just to fill up the time. Which is what I still do now, I think. [laughs]

Benji B

Obviously, drum & bass has been a huge influence on your life, but that’s not the music you make, is it? Genre-wise, if you had to define the music you make now, you wouldn’t put it in the drum & bass camp.

Martyn

No, but I think drum & bass has a few characteristics that you can also hear in early dubstep, for instance. A lot of UK bass music or whatever you want to call it. That’s in my music, so it’s still drums and bass for me, but yeah, it’s not like this or what drum & bass sounds like nowadays.

Benji B

Why don’t you bring it up to date and play us something, because I’m sure there are people here who’ve never heard your music? Why don’t you play us “Vancouver,” because I think it will really give us a good idea.

(music: Martyn – “Vancouver” / applause)

So that’s “Vancouver,” which came out last year, right?

Martyn

Yes.

Benji B

And is also on your album Great Lengths on 3024, which is your label.

Martyn

Yes.

Benji B

Now, you faded that because you wanted to, but one thing I love about your music is, even though it’s aimed squarely at the dancefloor – it has intro, middle and – one thing I love as a DJ, endings. Which we didn’t get to hear then, but it does have an end, it’s not just DJ beats on the way out. Is that a conscious decision, to make music that has that sort of flow?

Martyn

I don’t think about DJing too much when I’m making my music, so I do spend a lot of time making it into a song, more than a track to mix in and out of. A lot of music, especially in DJ music, is aimed at the dancefloor, so the only important part is the middle, the part you hear when you mix in and out of it. I think James Holden touched on this yesterday, when he was saying everyone just hears the middle two minutes of the track, so what’s the point of doing the intro and outro? Why make that interesting, because no one will ever hear it anyway? I have a little bit of a different opinion. I still think something should be interesting from the first to the last second, so that’s what I try to do, make it into more of a song, arrange it a little more, keep people on their toes for the whole song.

Benji B

It’s interesting you say you don’t design it for DJs because I get the sense that DJing is a really important part of what you do.

Martyn

You can do an interesting arrangement and DJ at the same time. One of the producers I loved from the D&B days was Jonny L. His arrangements were always really adventurous. The bassline never dropped at the right time, his tunes didn’t always even start on the one. He had all sorts of little tricks and he challenged me as a DJ to play these records. I had to practice and see if they’d fit in my sets, where you had to mix them, so it was actually much more fun playing those tracks and playing them right than your average, “skip through it a couple of times, this is the latest tune, I’ll play this tonight.” Because that’s also how a lot of DJs work, they just buy records and skip through them, they never actually listen to the whole thing before they play it out.

Benji B

How long have you been DJing?

Martyn

About 15 years.

Benji B

And how important has that been in formulating your identity as a producer?

Martyn

I never thought about making music in the first place, I was taken by surprise by everything. I didn’t think I was going to start a night, which I did, then I DJed on it. Then I made music, all of a sudden. Well, not all of a sudden, but I never planned these things. I never had any aspirations that I think I’d be a musician, I didn’t think I had the talent for it. I just kind of started it and developed it and now I do it.

Benji B

I’ve heard you describe DJing as a very emotional thing before.

Martyn

Well, I see DJing as an emotional thing because you kind of open up to people, you stand there in front of a crowd. Some DJs interact with the crowd directly by laughing at them and shaking their heads or whatever. I like to interact with people, but on a musical level, just by playing my music. All the music I play is music I really love, and some of the tracks have a real personal meaning and it’s very important for me to play these tracks to people because you can communicate some direct emotion. Old house tracks that you listened to when you fell in love with someone, if you share it with 500 people, it’s a very intense experience, because you’re standing there, almost crying or whatever and all these people are dancing to that tune. It just gives you a special kick, which is really what DJing is all about, to communicate this music.

Benji B

And what stuff can we hear in your DJ sets at present?

Martyn

It’s quite house-y nowadays. I used to play quite a lot of dubstep and old garage, it was all quite speedy, but I think things have slowed down a bit over the last year. I’ve got back into soulful house, New York-style stuff, Chicago, some electro.

Benji B

Were you into that stuff then, at the same time as drum & bass as well?

Martyn

Yeah.

Benji B

Have you got an example of music from that era you can play us?

Martyn

Old stuff?

Benji B

Yeah, maybe.

Martyn

I can play “Distant Planet.” This is Mr. Fingers. Very old, late ‘80s, with Robert Owens on vocals, a track called “Distant Planet.”

(music: Fingers Inc. – “Distant Planet”)

Benji B

So would you be going to parties in Holland playing that kind of stuff as well as coming to London to listen to drum & bass?

Martyn

This was a couple of years earlier, but when I first started going to clubs in about ’91, ’92 or something, this was the sound.

Benji B

And as someone who’s been there first time around with those records, obviously in the cyclical nature of music, that kinda stuff is coming back. How do you feel about it being regurgitated and redone at the moment?

Martyn

Well, I like that. I think back in those days there was lots of music and obviously only the really good tracks survived. The rest are in second-hand record stores somewhere in a basement and nobody looks at them. So only the good stuff survives and it’s nice to see a lot of younger people as well who completely missed that period of music pick it up, mix it up with a lot of newer tracks. Which is what I like to do. It’s not like my DJ sets are old stuff. It’s just a couple of things I like to play alongside newer things. I think what identifies my DJing is that it’s very percussive and very bass-heavy usually. Anything that goes on top is kind of fine. Whatever it is, a soulful vocal track or something with acid house reference or dubstep reference or techno reference, it doesn’t really matter for me, as long as it has good bass.

Benji B

Now, let’s talk about your producing. Obviously, there are many producers in the room, before we get onto the nerdy technical side of things, one of the things about the texture of your music is that I always find it immediately identifiable as you. Even if I don’t know it’s you, or it’s a white label or MP3 or something, I can always tell it’s your music because you have a sound. How long has it taken you in your journey to find that sound? Some people even call it “Martyn music,” you have your own genre.

Martyn

The Martyn music thing was my invention, it had nothing to do with making music. I was DJing in the drum & bass days and there was a promoter in Berlin, you know that Watergate club? There was a promoter there and he was like, “What sort of music do you play? I have to explain to people what sort of music you DJ.” “I don’t know, it’s so many different things.” So I just joked it was Martyn music. But that was more about the DJing. That wasn’t actually me defining my own music as a genre, but it started to lead its own life and now people refer to my productions as Martyn music.

Benji B

It’s not like a music that fits into a conventional category, but it does sound like you. I’m just interested in your journey through drum & bass, obviously producing drum & bass for some years, you seem to have arrived at a point where you really have got your sound and I was interested in talking about your journey of getting to that place.

Martyn

I think I have a whole library of different music in my head. There’s lots of music I’ve been through, lots of music that I buy, and you come up with a sound of your own in that realm. I try not to think about genres too much, so I don’t think, “I’m gonna make a house track or a dubstep track.” I think more of the concept, “I want to do a track with this frequency or with an interesting idea. I want the strings to go like this or I want to do this.” I work from that idea instead of working from the beat and the bassline. I don’t know how any of you make music, but a lot of people seem to be starting with a loop, make a beat, have a bassline, add some sounds and then work it out into a song or a tune. I work exactly the other way around, I start with the sounds, I collect all sorts of interesting sounds and then I form an idea. Once I have the idea down I figure out what the beats and the bassline will be like. For me it’s exactly the other way around. If you’re Prince and you’re writing a song, you never start with a beat. You start with a chorus, which is the nucleus of the tune. So that’s how I try to do it. I start with a riff, what’s the main idea of the track? Like, with the “Vancouver” track I played, my idea was I have these sort of stabby sounds and I have a progression in these stabby sounds, work with filters, build it up to a climax, then bring it back down and la, la, la. So I start with that and make that work, and then I come up with the tempo and then I come up with what sort of beat it should be and what sort of bassline it should be. Does that make any sense?

Benji B

Definitely. Picking up on what you said about frequency, one thing that strikes me about your music is that it’s not top-led or bassline-led, you have all the frequencies going on at all times. You have amazing toplines and obviously the basslines are important. But there seems to be a particular texture in the music you go for. What is it that you look for in the music you buy and what are you trying to project in the music that you make?

Martyn

It’s just like in the warm-up track we played, where we did the jumping jacks, the drum & bass thing, it basically has three fields in my mind. It has a bassline, which is for the stomach. It has a beat, which is for the chest. Then it has the toplines, like strings or a sort of piercing sound, which is more like a brainwave. So it’s these three fields, and all the music I like to play has to have these three elements, otherwise it’s not really music to me. That’s what I try to do in my tunes as well. You have to cover these three bases and make them all interesting enough.

Benji B

One track that springs to mind with regards to all that stuff is “Mega Drive Generation.” Can we play that?

Martyn

Yeah, that’s another one which I started out – there’s a strings part in the middle, you’ll hear it in a bit – and my idea was to do something with the strings part and make a gliding noise that sounds a bit unsettling,I guess. So that’s what I did first, then I came up with the rest of the track. So that’s a good example, I guess.

(music: Martyn – “Mega Drive Generation” / applause)

I call this the one with the whining strings, ‘cause they were whining.

Benji B

So where did you start on that tune? Talk us through the process of how you come up with a piece of music like that.

Martyn

Hard to remember, actually. I made this for Hyperdub. Kode9 is a good friend of mine and he was doing a CD to celebrate five years of Hyperdub, so he asked me for a track. I guess it was also inspired by the DJing I did at the time and also by a lot of the artists on Hyperdub. It’s quite percussive with new people like Ikonika and Cooly G and that sort of style. A lot of the music I play is that stuff anyway. So that’s how it started.

Benji B

But in terms of constructing the tune, it’s interesting what you said before about doing the opposite. You absolutely don’t start with a four-bar loop, build it up and then spread it out?

Martyn

Oh, no. That middle part, with the gliding strings... [plays the section], that’s where I started the tune.

Benji B

So you started in the breakdown, basically.

Martyn

Yeah, I thought that’s the most important part of the tune, it builds up to that and then it comes back down. So that’s how it started. Then you build all the percussion around that, then all the way in the end you get the bassline in there for extra fun.

Benji B

So you’re constructing all the way along the page.

Martyn

More or less. I did a thing with Ryan the other day. It takes me an hour or so to get everything working, but then I’m already arranging. I’m already at three or four minutes, doing stuff there rather than finishing that perfect loop.

Benji B

And what programs are you using for your stuff?

Martyn

I use Logic. I also use Ableton, but more as a sketch pad because it’s really easy to time-stretch stuff in there and fool around with samples and loops and things like that. Sometimes I come up with interesting stuff and I use that, but all the arrangement and mixing down and all that stuff is done in Logic.

Benji B

Arrangement is a word you use a lot and I want to talk to you more about that. Obviously, as a DJ you get sent hundreds upon hundreds of dancefloor records that are really formulaic and easy to play with because you know exactly what’s going to happen before you play the tune. That absolutely doesn’t apply to your music and it really does have an arrangement in the more traditional song sense, even though it’s club music, do you know what I’m saying? So I want to talk about the importance of arrangement in your records.

Martyn

If you listen to someone else’s track, you need to be kept on your toes at all times. The music has to stay interesting all the way through. If I get a tune sent, you can usually tell in the first minute if it’s interesting enough to listen to ‘til the end. There are a couple of things you can think of when you’re arranging a track. Adding certain elements to build something up can be interesting, but it may be more interesting to add two elements, then take them all out and then come back. Just do something interesting, try and look at the formulas and make variations on them to keep it more interesting. I might have a nice example of an English producer called Actress, he did a remix for Joy Orbison. I’ll just play the first minute, but there are so many things happening in that first minute already, it just keeps you on your toes. What else is he going to do in the next eight minutes and 30 seconds? So this is just an example of how you can arrange stuff a bit more interestingly, more adventurously, than just starting with the beat, adding the hi-hat, adding a little sound, three lasers and the drop.

(music: Joy Orbison – “The Shrew Would Have Cushioned the Blow (Actress Remix)”)

See, in the first minute there’s already three tunes’ worth of stuff happening. There’s lasers and hi-hats, the beat drops out and it comes back in at an awkward time, there’s so many things going on basically. You can really hear this is an incredibly creative person that put this together. Even if you don’t like the style, you can tell there’s so much going on. If you listen to an old Human League song, that has arrangements as well that keep you on your toes. I think that’s the key to my music and my DJing as well.

Benji B

You were telling me you write out in notebooks, when you’re doing an album you almost write the track in words before you make it. You don’t just sit down and see what comes out beats-wise, you write down what you want to achieve emotionally.

Martyn

I don’t really work on the road. I’m really bad at making music while travelling, so I just use other ways to lay ideas down. One of them is a notebook that I always have with me and can write stuff in it. Now I have an iPhone, which I can make notes in as well.

Benji B

I know it’s a personal thing obviously, but what sort of things do you write?

Martyn

It could be anything. It could be a description of a place where I’ve been, something that I did there. But it could also be something really blunt, like, “use house-y stab from that folder for riff, plus add strings,” or, “cut up break from nah, nah, nah and put it there.” There are different ways of writing stuff down, I guess. I also have a recorder that I use for recording sounds, a little Yamaha piece. It records in WAVs, so I just take that everywhere, and if I’m next to a traffic light in Madrid and hear an interesting bleepy sound, then I can just record it like that. [mimes holding up handheld recorder to traffic light] I use stuff like that all the time, sometimes not in the music but just as a vibe off point. My studio is completely white, all the walls, there’s nothing here, just a computer and some records. So I use sounds like that to bring me back to a certain vibe. In the Madrid case, I really like that city and it has good food. I really like the sounds and stuff so I want to do something with this. Or I sit in my white studio and listen to the traffic sounds from Madrid and that kind of brings me back there. That’s where I start from and just make music.

Benji B

Talking of sound effects and segues, the album itself is arranged. It’s not often now that you get “dance music” records that have an LP that’s obviously been planned with interludes and bridges and so on. Did you sit down and consciously say, “I’m going to make an album that is based on dance music but that you can listen to from start to finish”? That’s quite rare now.

Martyn

Not that literally, but I did arrange the tracks. When I DJ I always start high energy, a lot of tempo, a lot of percussion, a lot of bass bass, just to shake people up a little bit like we did here, so people know that I’m playing now basically. The album is based like that, too. It’s kind of like a DJ set in an hour and ten minutes. It starts off quite high energy, then it takes things a little deeper, then there are two tracks without beats, then there’s a highly emotional point with a vocal track, then it becomes a little more expressive towards the end. So it’s really like a DJ set for me. So I thought about that, not, “Oh, I need to do a variety of styles and that’s important.” More like how an interesting DJ set would sound like.

Benji B

Can we play another track from the record? Maybe “Elden Street.” But it’s up to you.

(music: Martyn – “Elden St.” / applause)

Before I forget, I’ve got a couple of notes here about some of your remixes. I’ve been asked: “Martyn’s Bittersweet Mix,” “Martyn’s Dark Mix,” “Martyn’s Round & Round Mix,” “Martyn’s Angel Of the North Mix,” “Martyn’s 3024 Robot Mix,” “Martyn’s Down Mix,” “Martyn’s DCM Mix” – what are all these names about? – “Martyn’s Heart Beat Mix,” “Martyn’s Seventh Mix.”

Martyn

I really like old house records, they always had a main version then on the other side there was always a beat mix or a dub mix, etc. etc. etc. If you do a remix of another track, you can’t put your own title in there. So this way I bypass that and still have my own title, which I like. I was inspired by old house tracks I just thought, you know, I should start naming my remixes. There’s one, my favorite remix name was Kenny Larkin. Do you know Kenny Larkin? An old Detroit producer, and his name was something like “Kenny Are You Sure This Is the Same Tune Mix?” probably the longest mix name I’ve ever heard.

Benji B

I think Skream just did one of “Where Were You In ‘92” and called it the “I Was In Kindergarten Mix,” which is a good one. [laughter]

Martyn

That’s in my top ten.

Benji B

I’ve got some notes here that you’ve done releases on the following labels: Hyperdub, Tectonic, Warp, Tempa, Revolve:r, Apple Pips, Hotflush, Aus Music, Watergate, Fat City, SoulJazz. Those are, you know, influential…

Martyn

Ticking all the boxes.

Benji B

Yes, some of the most interesting labels in terms of music I’m getting sent on the more electronic side of things at the moment. And, of course, we had FlyLo do a lecture yesterday and you’re very much part of the Brainfeeder connection as well. Do you want to talk about the Brainfeeder connection and then beyond that your wider peer group as well?

Martyn

Brainfeeder is very much an instrumental hip-hop-related thing, obviously with FlyLo and a couple of the other people involved in it. I think what happened with him is he started traveling abroad a lot, he was in London a lot, and picked up on a lot of different music on his travels. I think that’s how he got in touch with me, via a mutual friend who played some music by me to him and he said, “Wow, what is this guy doing?” Then he found out I lived in the States myself and we started talking about things like that. We met up with Kode9 as well at Mutek, and he invited me to the Brainfeeder nights I started playing there, and yeah, it just worked. The same goes for Kode9 and Hudson Mohawke, they’re all part of the thing as well – not the core people, not the people who are on the label, but people who play regularly at the nights. I think what’s nice about Brainfeeder as well is there’s such a variety of styles, you can compare it to the Muppets. Everyone is a different character. I think there was this quote from me where I said everyone’s a Muppet and Gaslamp [Killer] is Animal.

Benji B

That’s not a hard one.

Martyn

Yeah, it’s like the X-Men or something, everyone brings something different to the table, which is really nice ‘cause you don’t have any competition. What FlyLo does is what he’s best at, and I do what I’m best at. It’s just nice.

Benji B

And how does that work? ‘Cause obviously the music that you make is quite different from some people. How does that work on a Brainfeeder night? I guess we’re going to find out tomorrow night.

Martyn

It’s quite simple: everyone does what he wants to do. I do go a bit more eclectic on the Brainfeeder night, Ijust know I can go a bit more eclectic. I’ll play some old music. It doesn’t all have to be super-dancefloor because there are other people who take care of that part. You don’t have to go all headnod either because there are other people who do that. It’s just the bit in the middle, I guess. FlyLo’s sets have that nice arc of excitement and because I know what his sets are like, because I’ve seen so many of them, then I know how to play afterwards. And if I play before him, then I know where to end so he can pick up and do his thing. That goes for all of them, I’ve played with Nosaj Thing recently, and he’s got a different energy. Then there’s Daedelus who’s a completely different story altogether.

Benji B

The thing that links all those names for me is that as soon as you say them, I can instantly hear a sound. That’s a very distinct and individual identity. Flying Lotus is obviously totally in that category. If I hear a record, I can instantly tell whether it’s him or not. One thing he was talking about in his lecture yesterday is that he’s kind of getting tired of the flattery of imitation, a bit tired of people biting. I guess, people seeking to emulate wouldn’t fit into the Brainfeeder thing ‘cause everyone has a clear identity. There’s a lot of music I receive at the moment that seems to be under the influence of this future garage, a new wave of music that seems to be in your territory. I just wonder if you felt like FlyLo does, whether there are quite a few people that are overstepping the “imitation is the greatest form of flattery” line.

Martyn

I think if you make music that sounds like FlyLo, then you’re definitely not going to make it on to Brainfeeder because there’s already FlyLo. There’s no point in trying to make that same music. It’s a tricky subject. There are two ways of imitating someone. If you do your homework and have influences – and people love FlyLo’s stuff, they love Dilla, they love Waajeed, they really dig deep and find out what they’re about, why they do what they do – then, obviously, that’s going to be stuck in your brain when you make music. Then if your music sounds alike that’s an influence. If you just listen to FlyLo, have no clue where he came from, but you hear how big he is and just make music based on that one sound, then it’s not influences anymore. Then it’s biting. That’s the difference. Either you put in the groundwork yourself and study hard like a ninja for five years, or like a Shaolin monk, and just go in and try to find out everything you can find out about this music.

Benji B

But I know you do feel there’s stuff out there. Obviously, it’s taken you 15 years on your journey of DJing. I’m not saying that’s how long it takes to find your sound, it might be 15 months.

Martyn

There is a theory that everyone who chooses a craft has to spend ten years of full-time dedication to get where he wants to be. They looked this up all over science and arts and sports and all that sort of stuff. It kind of makes sense. Like a football player as well, the point where he goes “I’m gonna be a pro,” is around ten or so, so around 18-20, ten years later of full-time dedication later, that’s where he gets picked up by PSV Eindhoven. And then bought by Arsenal.

Benji B

I knew we were going to get onto football.

Martyn

I always have a football reference. But you know what I mean? It’s the ten- year dedication. I wouldn’t say it’s completely true in my case, but it’s definitely something to think about. It doesn’t really matter if it takes a long time to specialize yourself in your craft. I mean, of course, it’s nice if you want to be a musician and two years later you can travel the world, that’s lovely. But you have time, you don’t have to do everything so fast. Biting also has to do with finding a short-cut to success – you want to become a musician, be a DJ and travel the world but you don’t want to put in the hours. So what do you do? You pick whatever sound is big and start with that and copy it. Sometimes people do it consciously, sometimes it just happens unconsciously because people’s minds are wired that way.

Benji B

I’ve heard you speak strongly about this as well, even about DJing, how the technology of DJing has changed the hunt for music, and the effort you put in spending five years looking for that one record. Do you want to talk about that? You were quite passionate about it when we spoke about it.

Martyn

As I said before, DJing is a very personal thing. All these tracks mean something to me. All these tracks I play mean something, whether they’re new or old, especially the old ones because you know how it is, you go the record stores hunting for these tunes, sometimes it takes you years to find them. Now things have changed a little bit because of the power of the internet. You can get the tune via the click of a button. But you still need to search. There’s still stuff you need to find out before you can find the tune. Sometimes it’s difficult, because I use Serato and it has the name of the tune and the artist, sometimes the label. You DJ somewhere, there’s people behind you in the booth and they see what you play. One day later, they go online, find some sort of torrent, find that tune and start playing it as well. I don’t own the tune, so everyone can play whatever sort of music they want, obviously. But to me it’s kind of a personal thing that someone takes away. Back in the day people thought the same about photographs; if we take a photograph of you, we take a bit of your soul.

Benji B

But there’s a balance to be found between sharing information, going, “Oh, there’s this tune, you’ve got to hear it, you should have it.” There are tunes I’ve heard you play that I’d want to play and vice versa and that’s part and parcel. Are you from the school of covering the label up?

Martyn

I never was like that.

Benji B

Are you just talking about how technology has changed that?

Martyn

Yes, I never really was like that and I always thought the label-covering thing was bullshit, really. That was meant to be a sign of secrecy, sort of like the Freemasons. “We know what the tune is but you don’t.” That’s all nice, but that wasn’t really what I was about. I still think that if music is good, it deserves to be heard by a lot of people. If I hear a tune that I love, then it deserves to be loved, and it would be good for you to play as well, then I’ll give you the tune. “Check this guy out, you should play him on the show. It would be good for him, good for you.” So I’m not about keeping things secret. It’s just a different thing when you put in all this work and someone else walks away with it.

Benji B

So you mean looking for that random 1994 house 12: that would’ve taken you five years, and it did take you five years, and you put into Serato and then some journalist…

Martyn

He puts it on the website. Says, “Yeah, he was playing this and this and such and such a track on this label.”

Benji B

Not because he or she recognizes it, but because he or she read it on your computer.

Martyn

Yeah. It’s just a shame things have to go like that sometimes, but there’s nothing you can do. The only thing you can do about it is just be one step ahead all the time. It’s a nice sort of drive. Whenever people find out about your secret weapons – you just have to find more secret weapons.

Benji B

People lump you in the dubstep category and the future garage category, is that a bit of a hindrance to you?

Martyn

No. I just don’t really listen to it. I guess, the only real category I was in was in is drum & bass, where I was really dedicated to this one style of music. After that I let that kind of go because there was no real excitement to me in listening to it anymore. It started to become a hindrance listening to it and I thought, “This is not right. I should do something else, or quit music.” It wasn’t an easy decision for me at all. But I knew I still had something to express and that’s why I kept making music. I never really thought of genres, I just thought I’m going to let all this go and make my music, let other people decide what genre it is. I’m not against the whole genre thing, but I just think it limits you while you make your music or while you’re DJing. It sounds quite simple and I think it really is. I think other people make it a much more big deal than it really is.

Benji B

You mentioned your studio before, how it’s very plain, white walls. But it’s also relevant to talk about your environment and how that shaped you musically. You were originally from the Netherlands but you don’t live there anymore. Where are you now?

Martyn

I’m in Washington, DC.

Benji B

How has that shaped your musical brain?

Martyn

I grew up in Eindhoven, the south of Holland, then I lived in Rotterdam for a while. Both are major cities, in the Netherlands at least. Then I got married, my wife is American, and we moved to Washington, DC, for that mainly, not for the music. Now I kind of live in the suburbs, which is extremely quiet, absolutely nothing. I have no driver’s licence so I don’t drive anywhere either. So basically, I have a gas station I can walk to and that’s it. The rest is just fields and mountains. And I quit smoking so there’s no need to go the gas station either.

Benji B

I think this is a relevant thing to talk about. All of these genres, future garage, this, that and whatever, are very much born out of the metropolis, London, New York, whatever. It seems to me like you don’t like to stay there too long. You like to dip into that and then go somewhere that’s devoid of any kind of outside influence.

Martyn

Yeah, it’s not only London. I have the same feeling in Berlin, where there are also lots and lots of musical influences, lots of people doing great clubs. It’s nice to go to a place like that and absorb whatever there is, the vibe, certain people you talk to, certain music you listen to, and then go away. Go to your own little shack in a big field and do something with all this information. Over the last few years I’ve really enjoyed that peripheral feeling, where you’re outside everything. A few weeks ago, I was in Lisbon doing a workshop and I could really relate to the people there because they’re kind of outside of things as well. Lisbon is a very big city, but on the music scale, it’s on the outside. I was like, you should use whatever you have here and make something interesting that’s unique to this city and this country. Obviously Portugal has a lot of interesting musical influences, so people should do something with that.

Benji B

And in Holland, there’s Eindhoven and Rotterdam, which are major, major cities, you lived in both, but when people think of Holland they think of Amsterdam. So you’re on the outside in that sense as well.

Martyn

Yeah, they say Eindhoven has a Calimero complex. Do you know Calimero? It was a little cartoon from the ‘80s or ‘70s. But the people from Eindhoven are always like, well, the best thing from Amsterdam is the train to Eindhoven. They’re against this [idea of] Amsterdam is the big city in the Netherlands and everything happens in Amsterdam and blah, blah, blah. There’s always some sort of nice little rivalry. You kind of want to prove yourself a little bit more because you’re not from Amsterdam but from a different city.

Benji B

As a visitor, I haven’t been to Eindhoven that many times, but I’ve been to Amsterdam and Rotterdam lots of times, and it seems like Amsterdam is the flashy cool, cool place and Rotterdam is the working man’s town.

Martyn

Definitely, all the people are very straightforward, a bit too honest sometimes. It’s a workman’s place and people respect you if you put in the effort. If you don’t, if you just network your way up, they’ll be like, “That’s not real.”

Benji B

So do you think that also had an effect on how you approach the industry?

Martyn

Yeah, it’s a harbor town. That’s what happens in the harbor – you either work hard, or you die. That’s the attitude people have there. You see it in other harbor cities, too, like in Hamburg. Even Manchester, Liverpool. I relate to those sorts of cities, I guess.

Benji B

Now, being an Eindhoven fan, I apologize if there aren’t any football fans in the room, but you are of an age when you were growing up with the golden, golden era of Dutch football. More significantly than that, you come from a very sporting family, right?

Martyn

Yeah, my dad used to play football, for PSV Eindhoven.

Benji B

He didn’t just play, he was pretty special.

Martyn

Yeah, he was good, he was good. He won the UEFA Cup twice, and yeah, props to the family.

Benji B

So how many keep-ups can you do?

Martyn

I can do three. I think my dad’s record is about 300. That was a proper 20-25 minutes of doing it.

Benji B

So as a kid were you there, stopwatch in hand?

Martyn

Yes, there are two things I remember from my being a kid. Standing in the woods while he would do laps as a recovery from an injury or something like that. He would have to run laps and I would look at the stopwatch and see if he was on schedule. The other thing was counting the kicks.

Benji B

So talking about music, balance, work/life balance, sport and football, did that have an influence on your work and the way you approach stuff as well? I’m just trying to weave football in there?

Martyn

Yeah, that’s good, I like that. It’s sort of a similar life, you start very young with a passion and you try to build that passion into a life, into something to do. You hope you have some sort of talent and you build on this talent and try to make a living out of it as well. That’s your mission in life and, I guess, he had that with playing football. You started as a kid and you want to become bigger and bigger. It’s similar to what I did with music. Add to that your family life is radically different to the norm. When I grew up our family life was completely different, because everything revolved around Sunday, when the match was. Our rhythm in the week was completely different from other people. Plus your father is away a lot because of traveling and all that. So it makes an impact, but I guess, I only learned from it.

Benji B

It seems you have quite a DIY approach. I see a lot of people with managers and entourages, but you run a successful independent record label yourself. How do you do manage to do that and produce and DJ at the same time?

Martyn

I guess I’m a bit of a control freak, where you just want to be in charge of everything. Sometimes that’s good and sometimes that’s not so good, but you just learn from it. It’s nice to do all the stuff yourself. With my album, I made it musically in about five months, I think, and then I spent the next five months being the label manager and getting the product out, sorting out distribution, chasing everyone, getting the artwork in check.

Benji B

Artwork seems like an important part of things. It was very memorable, the cover of your album, and that’s quite rare in this digital iTunes era.

Martyn

It’s a friend of mine called Erosie and he lives in Eindhoven still. He’s kind of the same generation as me, but what I did with music he did with graphic design and art and street art as well, so we kind of have a similar development in what we do. In that sense we can talk to each other and he understands what I’m going through in music and I understand what he goes through in art. So we talk about stuff like that and that’s why he’s linked to the label and that’s why he does all the artwork for it.

Benji B

So apart from yourself, who have you released and are you going to be releasing on 3024 Recordings?

Martyn

There’s another Dutch guy called 2562, who also goes by the name of Made Up Sound. FlyLo did a remix for me.I had remix 12"s with Zomby and Ben Klock, Redshape, Roska, he was here as well, right? And then Illum Sphere for a new 12", which is exciting. So we’re expanding a little bit. I’ve found some help, because I was a bit too busy with the label, so I have a couple of people assisting. This is nice because now I can promote other people as well. The label pulled in a lot of interest around the globe and it’s an opportunity to bring in new talent.

Benji B

I’m sure there are some questions, but before we get into that, do you want to play some tunes, play something from the label, maybe a remix of yours?

Martyn

We’ll play “Hear Me,” the Zomby remix first.

(music: Martyn – “Hear Me (Zomby Remix)”)

I’ll also play the Flying Lotus remix he did for my label of a tune called “Natural Selection.”

(music: Martyn – “Natural Selection (Flying Lotus Remix)”)

(music: Flying Lotus – “RobertaFlack (Martyn’s Heart Beat Remix)” / applause)

Benji B

The Martyn what remix?

Martyn

A remix of “RobertaFlack” by Flying Lotus.

Benji B

And what did you call that one?

Martyn

The “Heartbeat Remix.”

Benji B

OK. Any questions for – and what should I call you, Mar-tyn or Mar-tyne?

Martyn

Mar-tyn.

Benji B

Any questions for Martyn?

Audience member

When you were in Lisbon you told us this story. You were going to clubs in the Netherlands when you were very young, not old enough to get in and you didn’t have a fake ID, like Flying Lotus.

Martyn

Oh, you want to hear the story again? [laughter]

Benji B

It’s 21 in the States, but only 18 in Europe, right?

Martyn

Eighteen, yeah. You’re referring to this after-hours club. In Eindhoven we had this club. Eindhoven is between Amsterdam and Rotterdam on one side and Brussels and Ghent and Antwerp on another. In those days, this was where a lot of techno nights happened. Eindhoven had a little club called Funky Business and a lot of these DJs that played either in Amsterdam or in Belgium, they would come to Eindhoven and play the after-hours, say between four and nine in the morning or something. I always wanted to go there but I was too young to get in. I could go out to normal clubs ‘cause you had to be 16 to get into a club in Holland, but after-hours is 18. Thank god the bouncer was gay. Like, a very, very, very big gay guy, and we just had to kind of use our charm to get in. [laughter] He loved us because we were young little… That’s what we had to get in and hear music. Then we were stuck in the back of the club so no one would chuck us out.

Benji B

Flirting or what?

Martyn

You have to do what you have to do sometimes. [laughter] No, it wasn’t that bad.

Audience Member

How many records do you have in your collection?

Martyn

I don’t know, it’s spread out over different addresses. I have a lot in America nowadays as well, but the bulk is still in Holland in storage. About 15,000 maybe. Twenty thousand. I started buying when I was seven with allowance money. Do you know a tune called “Safety Dance,” Men Without Hats? Bad. That was my first single. That’s where I started and ever since I just buy music whenever.

Audience member

Can you play us Prince?

Martyn

You want to hear Prince?

Audience member

Why not?

Martyn

I’ll just do a little clip and then you can think of more questions. Which one did we play last time, can you remember? A little Prince interlude.

(music: Prince – “When Doves Cry”)

Benji B

I wanted to ask about vocals, because this reminded me. There are only about two tunes of yours that have got vocals on them. I associate your music with a very soul element, very soulful music. But the tracks that you’ve been sending me recently have a real rock-type vocal on them. Is that intentional? Is that where you’re headed?

Martyn

I don’t think it’s intentional, but I think living in the States I might have been a tiny bit more exposed to rock music. It’s a bit more present over there than it is over here. The position that electronic music takes in Europe is kind of what indie rock is for the US. Indie rock bands are big there, they tour around, and if you’re a college kid there, you don’t go to raves, you go to concerts. So this rock thing, ever since I’ve lived there I’ve started to listen to a lot more guitar-oriented music again. And via, via, via, I got in touch with this band from London called the Detachments, which is kind of Joy Division for 2010, something like that, but with a bit more electro-y influences. Just really nice songs. So I got really into that, you know like Maximo Park. Obviously, if I like a tune I’ll try to remix it, make my own version of it, so that’s what I did. I stepped up and said, “If you ever need a remix, I’ll be happy to do one.” So that’s what I did, now I’m remixing indie rock. But it’s really about the song, a song either appeals to you or it doesn’t, and if it does, then it doesn’t really matter what style it is, I think. I wouldn’t say my music has become a lot wider in that way, it’s just another influence. But we’ll see what happens. I mean, I have some ideas for my next album that are in that direction as well.

Benji B

Any more for any more?

Audience Member

Hi, I wanted to ask you something about your production. You use very dry sounds, I would say without any reverb. So what equipment do you use and is it intentional that you keep this dry sound really warm and...?

Martyn

I don’t know if it’s that dry. I just forget about reverbs and things like that a lot as well, because they don’t really have a function. Or if the function is just to make it sound more cool. [shrugs]

Audience member

It’s really present, I would say, really in front.

Martyn

Yeah. One thing to get a bit technical that people might find useful, if I do mix-downs, usually people just blast the music basically in the studio, have it really loud so you can hear every little detail and mix-down your tune like that. But I think it’s really important, I saw it once in a tutorial video, to turn it down almost to a minimum so you can barely hear the track, and then judge if you can still hear all the elements you want to bring across basically. That’s what I do a lot when I do my mixdowns. Usually, it’s quite hard in the studio, but I always try and bring it down as well, give my ears a rest at the same time. If you play it at bare minimum volume, but you can still hear the vocal, the bass, the beat, things you want to bring across, but then bring it back up, the balance is perfect. All the elements that you want to communicate are there. So, I guess, that’s one of the reasons. I’m still worried about this dry thing, I don’t think it’s that dry. I guess it’s just the sounds that appeal to you. I like to keep things very organic, use a lot of extra sound, stuff that you get for free. If you use a kickdrum from a record and there’s a little bit of crackle at the end, why cut that off and just...

Audience Member

Which equipment do you use?

Martyn

Oh yeah. I use Logic Audio, a little bit of Ableton. I have a MicroKORG and a regular Korg K-61, which is a big keyboard.

Audience member

So you do the basslines with the microKORG? How do you do the basslines? Because they are very good.

Martyn

Just standard Logic sinewave signals, then compress ande drive and do what you have to to make it fit. It’s all very simple. But when I make music I love to play my keys. And another thing we did, with Ryan, we had this sound and the first thing I do is map it all over the keyboard and just start playing melodies. He says, “What the hell is this?” But for me it’s the most natural thing to do, to start playing on my keys and find nice combinations. That’s why the first thing I did when I moved to the States, because I had to get rid of a lot of equipment because I couldn’t ship it, was buy the biggest keyboard I could get. That’s why I have the 61 keys, which is this wide. [spreads his arms out] Which is totally unnecessary, really, because I can’t play that well. But I just want lots of keys, and it just makes me feel better having them. I might use only 20 of them, but at least I have 61 keys. But I think playing is very important, instead of just drawing blocks and stuff, I just like to have some sort of hands-on thing. An MPC would be good for me as well, I think.

Audience Member

Hi, I’m just wondering what the significance is of Prince. Obviously, he’s one of the greatest of all time, but why did you play that track?

Martyn

Why Prince? I think he was one of the first singer-songwriters, whatever you want to call him, who really made a lasting impression on me, when I was about eight, nine. The Purple Rain days and a bit before that, he was huge back then. I started buying his music as soon as I could and it stuck with me all through my life. The first day I could fit it into a DJ set was one of the happiest days of my life. Nowadays it’s almost a standard, to get that one Prince tune in at the beginning or the end, somewhere in the middle. For me, he’s an important person in music. He’s kind of DIY as well, isn’t here? Where he does everything and he’s an extreme control freak, everything goes his way, the purple way, not any other way. He’s a massive talent. He writes so many songs, it’s not even funny. Even now, maybe musically I’m not really into it that much anymore, the newer stuff, but between all the fancy arranging you can hear really strong pop songs.

Benji B

Any more questions?

Audience Member

Hi. So how important is vinyl to you and your record label? I’ve been working in record stores for ten years and seen the decline of it and the rise of the MP3, the lovely little thing. When you make your music do you do it in the hope people will be playing it on vinyl?

Martyn

I do like vinyl a lot and I buy a lot of vinyl still. It’s the music format of my generation. But music comes in whatever format. I’m not one of those people who’ll stick to vinyl for the sake of it, for the history of it. I suppose that tomorrow, there will be another invention, a new format, and that will be fine as well, as long as the music comes across and people are able to access the music. Obviously there is a physical appearance about vinyl, or even CDs nowadays, that I like better than buying MP3s online. If you give someone a record or you give someone a CD, it feels much better than giving them an iTunes gift card. So there is this physical thing I like about it, just to have something you can touch, a product. It’s important to at least make something.

Audience member

And the artwork, and the sound quality.

Martyn

Yeah, it’s a total package. This is why we spend a lot of time on the artwork. It’s like a gift. You give something to people and they can buy it in the shop and they have something to look at.

Audience member

And what about, for the amount of time you’ve been selling records on your label, have you seen it go down?

Martyn

Oh, no. Once you make good music I don’t think the sales affect you that much. They do in regards to ten years ago, because then if you had a really big tune you might sell ten thousand or something, fifteen. Now you would sell two, three thousand. But good music will always prevail. I think it’s the mediocre labels that have a much harder time selling records than the good ones. If you’re good, you’ll be fine. I’m not saying my stuff is exceptional, but I’m just saying that if you put in the effort and make sure you have a really good product, then yeah.

Audience member

In terms of dubstep and stuff it is really like yourself and Joy Orbison who are the very few who are selling...

Benji B

Thanks. You can finish your sentence.

Audience member

[inaudible]

Martyn

It’s also because the music stretches a bit further than dubstep, you have people from other scenes listening as well, picking up the odd record here and there. When you spread it across a little bit more, I guess you have a little bit more sales than usual.

Benji B

Are we gonna finish with more starjumps, more exercise? Maybe if you've got George Morel to send everyone off on a good vibe?

Martyn

No. [laughter]

Benji B

Are you gonna play something hard and dark?

Martyn

No.

Benji B

What have you got then?

Martyn

We should play something new and exciting.

Benji B

While you do that can you join me in saying thank you so much to Martyn.

[applause]